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[Game Update] - (BETA) 212539

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Donke60    3103
3 hours ago, StretchVanb said:

I know people won't listen to me because I was being a condescending jerkwad, but can we not get into a argument over skill or let 3-saxty Na-scapes over something as ridiculous as poison birchnut farms? I would like this community to be semi unified.

Too many people with too many different playstyle/opinions and we are (I think)i but only to outside forces to bad most strife is inside. 

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AnonymousKoala    3637
34 minutes ago, Donke60 said:

I would say that about fire farms if Kiel told us "its not a bug anymore think of it as a feature" but they haven't. Every says that the exmaples you just said and they are good examples but DS and something of TF2 which has a more competitve skill heavy atmosphere. Also is an entire different genre of game. I'm not saying all the "strats" the the pro players in the DS commuity should go and get patched out to make me a happy bugger. I'm fine and I like looking at solo boss contraptions. What I'm not fine with are things that really are bugs perma freeze, guardian getting stuck on objects to easily, infinte laterns, If a bug is really hard to pull off and excute  I don't mind those bugs because if they are that hard to do then you should be rewarded for your skills. But most bugs in DS aren't like that they can completely triviaize parts of the game and all you have to have is 1 to 2 things and your golden. Thats my problem with the bugs of DS
 

They weren't patched out though. Fire spreading changed, and the respawn timer is no longer bypassed by the fire as that part was a bug. a fire farm with a dwarf star for the freezing effect is still possible, and i doubt its because they glossed over that what with the million and 1 videos featuring it. They found potential in that bit of a fire farm, and its annoying enough to set up that its not op.

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Donke60    3103

Well we just heard it was a process I would be find with it If they told us we'll going to keep this bug or that bug.

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EuedeAdodooedoe    1187
4 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

They weren't patched out though. Fire spreading changed, and the respawn timer is no longer bypassed by the fire as that part was a bug. a fire farm with a dwarf star for the freezing effect is still possible, and i doubt its because they glossed over that what with the million and 1 videos featuring it. They found potential in that bit of a fire farm, and its annoying enough to set up that its not op.

It kind of is... Getting star caller staves late game is not difficult at all. They don't require thulecite, the gems can be obtained from Dragonfly well enough that killing weaver for them gives you more, but isn't really that necessary either.

Either way, I think it would be good if the freeze farm was gotten rid of by having snowballs of flingos not freeze mobs. It's just bizzarrely OP in some other scenarios as well. Perhaps it makes more sense and isn't so OP for things like lavae, but other than that... Idk, I might be a bit biased on this particular subject.

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AnonymousKoala    3637
Just now, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

It kind of is... Getting star caller staves late game is not difficult at all. They don't require thulecite, the gems can be obtained from Dragonfly well enough that killing weaver for them gives you more, but isn't really that necessary either.

Either way, I think it would be good if the freeze farm was gotten rid of by having snowballs of flingos not freeze mobs. It's just bizzarrely OP in some other scenarios as well. Perhaps it makes more sense and isn't so OP for things like lavae, but other than that... Idk, I might be a bit biased on this particular subject.

Most of the game isn't difficult. It's noob traps, practice, and things that are tedious to pull off. "Fire Farms" in DST fall into the third category, just like they did in DS. 

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EuedeAdodooedoe    1187
25 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

Most of the game isn't difficult. It's noob traps, practice, and things that are tedious to pull off. "Fire Farms" in DST fall into the third category, just like they did in DS. 

Tedious to pull off? Not really, you can use Freeze Farm (not really Fire Farm) in order to make frog rains trivial by spawning a star in a flingo radius and dropping some twigs around it. Fire farm is more tedious. Moon Stone Pig Skin farm is the most tedious, because of all the preparation you need prior and after the farm (i.e. repairing walls, because end tables alone aren't really enough since pigs can push each other through them, mostly when you're off-screen).

On a side note, for Shipwrecked, will firefarm work for Prime Ape Huts? If so, then you can use Fire Farm to spawn them indefinitely, Freeze Farm to kill them easily in order to pretty much guarantee you a Krampus sack essentially.

And yeah, it's a bit sad that the game isn't difficult. Some RNG for enemy attack patterns and attack periods could make it more exciting and difficult for sure.

the game is terrible at supporting newbies (directing them and giving some form of initial boost at the beginning, in case they start in harsh seasons. Check out this suggestion for one such solution for this).

Edited by EuedeAdodooedoe

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Maslak    4368
4 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

I did mention the werepig method, read through my post again to see what I have to say about that.

Also, how would newbies ever find out about the werepig method exactly through their own testing? Or comprehend it at least. It's the same problem as with ant lion, you just can't really know unless you read the wiki or whatever.

Trust me, it's pretty easy to learn this. I remember when I recruited pigs for first time in DS. "Oh, they chop trees with me!" "What the heck why did he turn brown?" *dies*
I quickly realised what happened.

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EuedeAdodooedoe    1187
4 minutes ago, Maslak said:

Trust me, it's pretty easy to learn this. I remember when I recruited pigs for first time in DS. "Oh, they chop trees with me!" "What the heck why did he turn brown?" *dies*
I quickly realised what happened.

You are correct and that is what the mechanic seems to be intended for, however that's not my point. This is:

4 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

Yes, you can werepig one, although that doesn't seem to be the reason why the werepigging mechanic exists and just feels like another mechanic cheese.

And even then, if it IS intended as a better way of getting pig skin, would you comprehend the mechanic of werepiging a pig being very beneficial in getting you more pig skin and meat as you did that? Doubt that, that's what my point was in relation to the ant lion.

Edited by EuedeAdodooedoe

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AnonymousKoala    3637
17 minutes ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

Tedious to pull off? Not really, you can use Freeze Farm (not really Fire Farm) in order to make frog rains trivial by spawning a star in a flingo radius and dropping some twigs around it. Fire farm is more tedious. Moon Stone Pig Skin farm is the most tedious, because of all the preparation you need prior and after the farm (i.e. repairing walls, because end tables alone aren't really enough since pigs can push each other through them, mostly when you're off-screen).

On a side note, for Shipwrecked, will firefarm work for Prime Ape Huts? If so, then you can use Fire Farm to spawn them indefinitely, Freeze Farm to kill them easily in order to pretty much guarantee you a Krampus sack essentially.

And yeah, it's a bit sad that the game isn't difficult. Some RNG for enemy attack patterns and attack periods could make it more exciting and difficult for sure.

the game is terrible at supporting newbies (directing them and giving some form of initial boost at the beginning, in case they start in harsh seasons. Check out this suggestion for one such solution for this).

Fire Farming monkey huts works less well iirc.

Also i don't think it's sad the game isn't difficult. It relies on practice and knowledge, that's how it does its difficulty. You learn the rules it sets and if you ever disobey them you're likely gonna die. A good game isn't good because its hard. It's good because you'd play through it even if it's "too" hard. And that's essentially what we all did when we started out.

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Donke60    3103
3 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

And even then, if it IS intended as a better way of getting pig skin, would you comprehend the mechanic of werepiging a pig being very beneficial in getting you more pig skin and meat as you did that?

It's risk verus reward also just a side note my first were pig was "I like that jingle sound, how much can I feed him will he be perment, why is he turning, this is bad yep run.

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Maslak    4368
1 hour ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

You are correct and that is what the mechanic seems to be intended for, however that's not my point. This is:

What? Check my post again. I quoted this part of your post:

Quote

I did mention the werepig method, read through my post again to see what I have to say about that.

Also, how would newbies ever find out about the werepig method exactly through their own testing? Or comprehend it at least. It's the same problem as with ant lion, you just can't really know unless you read the wiki or whatever.

And answered, that it's not hard to find out.

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EuedeAdodooedoe    1187
1 hour ago, AnonymousKoala said:

Fire Farming monkey huts works less well iirc.

Also i don't think it's sad the game isn't difficult. It relies on practice and knowledge, that's how it does its difficulty. You learn the rules it sets and if you ever disobey them you're likely gonna die. A good game isn't good because its hard. It's good because you'd play through it even if it's "too" hard. And that's essentially what we all did when we started out.

Yes, it works for single player, but it's grindingly annoying for multiplayer. And even then, being essentially a god just because you know everything makes the game a bit more dull.

Not that I'm for completely removing this type of learning curve (learning = you won't die), but newbies do need better support because it's a grind for late game players to take care of them AND because it's unfair. A rule of "you don't join the game in the middle of harsh seasons"? And having newbies that are at day 1 targeted by Deerclops just because they were the ones near some basic structures while everyone else is out fighting Dragonfly or some crap in caves? This isn't challenging, this is plane unfair! I can't tell you the amount of times I've had to rebuild firepits, lightning rods and omfg OCUVIGILS at portal because they were wrecked by a boss (deerclops or antlion) or burnt (ocuvigils, cause placing a flingo there... Yeah, pointless af!).

Edited by EuedeAdodooedoe

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EuedeAdodooedoe    1187
1 hour ago, Maslak said:

What? Check my post again. I quoted this part of your post:

And answered, that it's not hard to find out.

No, you're talking about:

* How newbies would find out how to werepig a pig

I'm talking about:

* That werepigging a pig is a good strat for getting more, guaranteed pig skin, so you should always do that if you can instead of killing normal pigs.

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Maslak    4368
6 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

Also, how would newbies ever find out about the werepig method exactly through their own testing? Or comprehend it at least. It's the same problem as with ant lion, you just can't really know unless you read the wiki or whatever.

Quote option lets user decide which sentences (wrote by someone else) they want to comment on. I decided to comment on this part of one of your posts in this thread, and I didn't say anything about how transforming pigs seems not so right/intended/fitting. You can't just tell me that I'm missing a point of something if I didn't even comment on it.

Edited by Maslak

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Donke60    3103
3 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

That werepigging a pig is a good strat for getting more, guaranteed pig skin, so you should always do that if you can instead of killing normal pigs

and it is but you should be good at fighting if your not then learn.

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EuedeAdodooedoe    1187
11 minutes ago, Maslak said:

Quote option lets user decide which sentences (wrote by someone else) they want to comment on. I decided to comment on this part of one of your posts in this thread, and I didn't say anything about how transforming pigs seems not so right/intended/fitting. You can't just tell me that I'm missing a point of something if I didn't even comment on it.

Oops, I think I'm confusing myself a little here with some parts and possibly have strawmanned there :p

Either way, my point was, on this, that new players would be able to figure out about the werepig transformation through just playing the game, however figuring out to do so in order to obtain more pig skin and meat not being something so comprehensive. And if that were to be an intended way to get pig skin decently, then it's not good enough at letting players who don't know about it find out about it without asking experienced players or checking the wiki.

4 minutes ago, Donke60 said:

and it is but you should be good at fighting if your not then learn.

Yes, but how would one find out that it's a good means of getting pig skin through game-play, that is the point I'm trying to put accross!

Edited by EuedeAdodooedoe

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Donke60    3103
3 hours ago, EuedeAdodooedoe said:

Yes, but how would one find out that it's a good means of getting pig skin through game-play, that is the point I'm trying to put accross!

Ok so let say a group or 2 new players makes a werepig and they fight it. There probably hurt a lot but they notice that the werepig drops 2 meat and a pigskin. Ok Well they don't want to do that cause it went really bad so they fight normal pig man like three it was easier but then they notice that they only 1 pigskin out of  3 pig man. They now know that to get pigskin it would be more effeciant to make werepigs because spiders are easier then fighting pigs. So they might fail a few times but they keep fighting werepigs or tougher mobs and boom they are good at fighting werepigs makes easier to get pigskin and in turn makes it easier for the new players to protect themselves.

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JimmyJam    1402

Its pretty simple to know if something is a bug or not. If the people who made the game call something a bug its a bug lol

I will miss this bug tho :/

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CarlZalph    4454
3 hours ago, Donke60 said:

Well we just heard it was a process I would be find with it If they told us we'll going to keep this bug or that bug.

Problem with stating what they're going to fix and not is that it would put them in a position where if they tried fixing something and it would need a large overhaul then they would be doing something not very cost-effective (1 bug versus possibly 20+ in the same time span).

Hence the priority and weighing of what 'needs to be fixed' and 'put it on a backburner and potentially fix at some point'.

Most of the bugs fixed were rather small code-wise when compared to the minimap being completely networked from the server.

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