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oCrapaCreeper

The Quaken has some glaring issues that need to be adressed

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AnonymousKoala    3,635
11 minutes ago, DeputyDeath said:

The running away seems to be a way of baiting you into more tentacles.

Anyway, the problem with armour is that you have 96% protection with a log suit and football helmet. You take so little damage from literally anything that any 'better' armour types make little difference. I only use a football helmet nowadays because 80% protection is more than I ever need when I'll restore the health whenever I eat anyway. The only exceptions are scalemail for fighting the dragonfly and the thelucite crown for tanking large groups of enemies with the forcefield active.

Now, regarding random items. It's hard to strike a balance between giving the player too much good stuff at once and giving them a bunch of almost worthless crap. For example, when you kill the ancient guardian you get a bunch of deceptively useless items, or at least you probably will never use them unless it's for the sake of wearing them down. The worst thing is that they're tools and gear rather than raw materials, which makes them far less useful later on than if you just got the materials needed to make it. But if you made it drop loads and loads of thelucite and gems, it'd just be far too powerful and would make the gear too easy to get.

The quacken has the same problem. I doubt anyone is going to destroy a thelucite crown and suit within 20 days, right? So then you just end up with piles and piles of top-tier armour that sits there gathering dust. Not to mention the numerous booty bags and chests of the deep that will be lying around.

I'd seriously rather that the Quacken would drop something other than the walking cane and booty bag too. The booty bag would be a great craftable item using a shadow manipulator (e.g. 5 blue/red gems, 20 dubloons and some boards), and I personally believe that the walking cane functions best as a random slot machine drop because it makes it unlikely that you'll end up with more than one. Maybe, like the dragonfly in DST, the Quacken could drop a bunch of gold, gems and trinkets instead.

I only use thulecite because my mind is kind of trained to think its better. also I have a lot of it thanks to SW.

And I like the idea of it being like Dragonfly in DST. 

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PhelsarusBeel    3,996

Just throwing this out here because it brought up. Raising the HP of the Quacken does not make it more challenging all it does is increase the amount of tedium of the fight. Currently the idea of the Quacken having 1000 HP but relocating itself each time it goes down 250 is neat but buffing it up to say 3000 (what is Sealnado/Bearger/Goose/Goose territory) is not a good solution. The reason is that once you'r up at the Quackens face you just whack it and each increase in HP only increases the amount of boring time you stand there whacking at it's face waiting for it to submerge again. Also the fact that you need to carry far more stuff with you around because you probably need a new Spear or something similar during the fight.

As for the loot. TBH if it would drop a bunch of dubloons and the likes it would maybe be better. Heck since the Quacken drops a chest what if it gets renamed from "Chest from the Deep" to something like "Ancient Pirate Treasure" and instead you get Gold, Dubloons and Gems (even possibly Yellow and Green ones meaning there is a more relyable source of those rather then the random Tumbleweed in RoG).

But i feel like it should not drop Thulecite Gear (maybe raw Thulecite again to get a renewable source of it.) nor the Cane or the Bootybag. Booty Bag imho should be a grand reward for Treasure Hunting aka you only ever get 1 (or possibly a Blueprint for it) while the Cane should remain in the Slotmachines loot pool.

I feel like atm it's better to look more at the drops of the Quacken then the actual boss. Cause here is the problem if it gets buffed to hard it's something you never want to go out and hunt expect for that 1 time you need the key for Woodlegs. But if we nerf the loot to hard no one is goin to hunt it because there is no decend payoff for killing it. We need to find a fine balance between the loot and the difficulty of the boss. Again i feel like Gold, Gems and raw Thulecite would be a good bossdrop since this way Quacken turns into a boss you hunt to make get more Endgamegear AFTER you explored the ruins and got acces to the crafting recipes of the Ancient tab.

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voyager156    359
1 hour ago, DeputyDeath said:

You see, what they should've done is made the blubber a fuel for lanterns, or a fire-based lantern that is fuelled exclusively by blubber. That would've made whales worth killing later on.

^ Yep, they should do it.

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AnonymousKoala    3,635
1 hour ago, Mr.P said:

Just throwing this out here because it brought up. Raising the HP of the Quacken does not make it more challenging all it does is increase the amount of tedium of the fight. Currently the idea of the Quacken having 1000 HP but relocating itself each time it goes down 250 is neat but buffing it up to say 3000 (what is Sealnado/Bearger/Goose/Goose territory) is not a good solution. The reason is that once you'r up at the Quackens face you just whack it and each increase in HP only increases the amount of boring time you stand there whacking at it's face waiting for it to submerge again. Also the fact that you need to carry far more stuff with you around because you probably need a new Spear or something similar during the fight.

As for the loot. TBH if it would drop a bunch of dubloons and the likes it would maybe be better. Heck since the Quacken drops a chest what if it gets renamed from "Chest from the Deep" to something like "Ancient Pirate Treasure" and instead you get Gold, Dubloons and Gems (even possibly Yellow and Green ones meaning there is a more relyable source of those rather then the random Tumbleweed in RoG).

But i feel like it should not drop Thulecite Gear (maybe raw Thulecite again to get a renewable source of it.) nor the Cane or the Bootybag. Booty Bag imho should be a grand reward for Treasure Hunting aka you only ever get 1 (or possibly a Blueprint for it) while the Cane should remain in the Slotmachines loot pool.

I feel like atm it's better to look more at the drops of the Quacken then the actual boss. Cause here is the problem if it gets buffed to hard it's something you never want to go out and hunt expect for that 1 time you need the key for Woodlegs. But if we nerf the loot to hard no one is goin to hunt it because there is no decend payoff for killing it. We need to find a fine balance between the loot and the difficulty of the boss. Again i feel like Gold, Gems and raw Thulecite would be a good bossdrop since this way Quacken turns into a boss you hunt to make get more Endgamegear AFTER you explored the ruins and got acces to the crafting recipes of the Ancient tab.

Booty Bag should possibly also come from slot machine maybe, but no clue.

All in all, I like this idea.

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DeputyDeath    262
2 hours ago, Mr.P said:

Just throwing this out here because it brought up. Raising the HP of the Quacken does not make it more challenging all it does is increase the amount of tedium of the fight. Currently the idea of the Quacken having 1000 HP but relocating itself each time it goes down 250 is neat but buffing it up to say 3000 (what is Sealnado/Bearger/Goose/Goose territory) is not a good solution. The reason is that once you'r up at the Quackens face you just whack it and each increase in HP only increases the amount of boring time you stand there whacking at it's face waiting for it to submerge again. Also the fact that you need to carry far more stuff with you around because you probably need a new Spear or something similar during the fight.

As for the loot. TBH if it would drop a bunch of dubloons and the likes it would maybe be better. Heck since the Quacken drops a chest what if it gets renamed from "Chest from the Deep" to something like "Ancient Pirate Treasure" and instead you get Gold, Dubloons and Gems (even possibly Yellow and Green ones meaning there is a more relyable source of those rather then the random Tumbleweed in RoG).

But i feel like it should not drop Thulecite Gear (maybe raw Thulecite again to get a renewable source of it.) nor the Cane or the Bootybag. Booty Bag imho should be a grand reward for Treasure Hunting aka you only ever get 1 (or possibly a Blueprint for it) while the Cane should remain in the Slotmachines loot pool.

I feel like atm it's better to look more at the drops of the Quacken then the actual boss. Cause here is the problem if it gets buffed to hard it's something you never want to go out and hunt expect for that 1 time you need the key for Woodlegs. But if we nerf the loot to hard no one is goin to hunt it because there is no decend payoff for killing it. We need to find a fine balance between the loot and the difficulty of the boss. Again i feel like Gold, Gems and raw Thulecite would be a good bossdrop since this way Quacken turns into a boss you hunt to make get more Endgamegear AFTER you explored the ruins and got acces to the crafting recipes of the Ancient tab.

I agree with everything you said EXCEPT the Quacken dropping thelucite instead of the armour. You have to remember that a lot of people don't like world linking and it would just be a massive 'screw you' to them if the Quacken was only good for getting dubloons.

If they have thelucite some uses in Shipwrecked in crafting recipes, then that's fine. It could replace the walking cane or booty bag. But I don't see why the armour is a problem really; it was the magic items in the ancient guardian's drop pool that were the issue, not the armour or club.

But your point about health is what I've been thinking for a while. More health does NOT make a giant harder to kill, unless we're talking about the ancient guardian or dragonfly in DST because they're insane. The dragonfly has less health than the Goose/Goose, and is it easier to kill? Of course not. The ancient guardian has less health than the bearger. Is it harder to kill? Of course not. The Varg has less health than any giant, and yet that b*stard can put up a much stronger fight than the deerclops or bearger if you're not careful.

If we really want to buff the Quacken then we should buff its damage. The current boss fight is the most insane bullet hell and general confusion that's in the game right now, and I find it cool how much chaos the Quacken can cause. Maybe the head would move to another point when you deal 100 damage within the ring of tentacles, and then the entire Quacken would change positions after dealing 250. That would force you to dodge waves for a bit longer. Maybe the Quacken could pull you in when he teleports for the last time to give you no chance to repair your boat, and his screams could stun the player whilst dealing damage over time equal to fire.

This would make Quacken a more interesting boss to fight, as the Shipwrecked bosses generally are compared to RoG, but it would need a loot buff for this to be at all balanced. Even now, I don't consider him particularly worth defeating.

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2 hours ago, DeputyDeath said:

But your point about health is what I've been thinking for a while. More health does NOT make a giant harder to kill, unless we're talking about the ancient guardian or dragonfly in DST because they're insane. The dragonfly has less health than the Goose/Goose, and is it easier to kill? Of course not. The ancient guardian has less health than the bearger. Is it harder to kill? Of course not. The Varg has less health than any giant, and yet that b*stard can put up a much stronger fight than the deerclops or bearger if you're not careful.

If we really want to buff the Quacken then we should buff its damage. The current boss fight is the most insane bullet hell and general confusion that's in the game right now, and I find it cool how much chaos the Quacken can cause. Maybe the head would move to another point when you deal 100 damage within the ring of tentacles, and then the entire Quacken would change positions after dealing 250. That would force you to dodge waves for a bit longer. Maybe the Quacken could pull you in when he teleports for the last time to give you no chance to repair your boat, and his screams could stun the player whilst dealing damage over time equal to fire.

This would make Quacken a more interesting boss to fight, as the Shipwrecked bosses generally are compared to RoG, but it would need a loot buff for this to be at all balanced. Even now, I don't consider him particularly worth defeating.

 Looking back at the buff suggestions I made, like the Quacken's screech pushing you back a full screen when you get up close, ink bombs that're also acidic, and longer-ranged tentacles that regenerate after it's down, I guess more health would just be pushing the tedium in the fight, huh? We'll save that for when Quacken is in DST.

I like your idea of how the Quacken's submerging tactic should be like, but I don't like the idea of the Quacken's screech actually being able to damage you. That would be the ink bombs' job, with its acidic residue, especially if the Quacken was given better aim. I think it'd be better if the Quacken just gave chase if you tried to sail away from it, rather than pulling you towards it. I can see how that might end up being a big problem, like if the tentacle dragged you too close and you got stunlocked by multiple tentacles, or how it might be more unfair then a giant giving chase (at least giants still give you a small chance of healing yourself).

9 hours ago, AnonymousKoala said:

And singing to make it rain is a non weird way to summon a giant squid monster because?

I suggested some time ago that the chest of the depths would contain unique loot only obtainable from it, that belonged to old sailors. Say, a ghost ship, that exists for as long as a pirate hat gained from the chest is worn. When the hat reaches 0% durability, so will the boat. Until then it'll be an incredibly strong ship.

Restoring broken ships would be just Kreygasm. I want this. 

 Well, I find trawling to summon the Quacken in Don't Starve strange because its too ordinary. I think summoning a monster via causing a storm would be the appropriate kind of weirdness in Don't Starve. I don't know, how do you think we should encounter the Quacken/summon it?

I think that wearing the magic pirate hat might drain sanity, considering it belonged to a dead guy, and its magical powers is what keeps its boat afloat. What would happen if you took it off while sailing on the magical boat?

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AnonymousKoala    3,635
4 minutes ago, DangWoodchuck said:

 Looking back at the buff suggestions I made, like the Quacken's screech pushing you back a full screen when you get up close, ink bombs that're also acidic, and longer-ranged tentacles that regenerate after it's down, I guess more health would just be pushing the tedium in the fight, huh? We'll save that for when Quacken is in DST.

I like your idea of how the Quacken's submerging tactic should be like, but I don't like the idea of the Quacken's screech actually being able to damage you. That would be the ink bombs' job, with its acidic residue, especially if the Quacken was given better aim. I think it'd be better if the Quacken just gave chase if you tried to sail away from it, rather than pulling you towards it. I can see how that might end up being a big problem, like if the tentacle dragged you too close and you got stunlocked by multiple tentacles, or how it might be more unfair then a giant giving chase (at least giants still give you a small chance of healing yourself).

 Well, I find trawling to summon the Quacken in Don't Starve strange because its too ordinary. I think summoning a monster via causing a storm would be the appropriate kind of weirdness in Don't Starve. I don't know, how do you think we should encounter the Quacken/summon it?

I think that wearing the magic pirate hat might drain sanity, considering it belonged to a dead guy, and its magical powers is what keeps its boat afloat. What would happen if you took it off while sailing on the magical boat?

You would sink. I mean, if you were on a boat, and hammered it, you would sink. Same for the boat just poofing out of existance. It would obviously drain a whole lot of sanity to wear the hat/be on the boat. 

Trawling kinda works. Quacken sees something moving, you are in the deep water after all, snatching dem treasures, and then it pops up to stop you from stealing its treasures. I imagine it hoards treasures, explaining the chest of the depths. 

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DeputyDeath    262
15 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

You would sink. I mean, if you were on a boat, and hammered it, you would sink. Same for the boat just poofing out of existance. It would obviously drain a whole lot of sanity to wear the hat/be on the boat. 

Trawling kinda works. Quacken sees something moving, you are in the deep water after all, snatching dem treasures, and then it pops up to stop you from stealing its treasures. I imagine it hoards treasures, explaining the chest of the depths. 

Yeah, judging by the crap I get from Quacken I can see that he likes hoarding bits of coral and seaweed.

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AnonymousKoala    3,635
5 minutes ago, DeputyDeath said:

Yeah, judging by the crap I get from Quacken I can see that he likes hoarding bits of coral and seaweed.

And compasses.

 

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15 minutes ago, AnonymousKoala said:

Trawling kinda works. Quacken sees something moving, you are in the deep water after all, snatching dem treasures, and then it pops up to stop you from stealing its treasures. I imagine it hoards treasures, explaining the chest of the depths. 

  I guess it is like robbing the Quacken.

 

Just now, DeputyDeath said:

Yeah, judging by the crap I get from Quacken I can see that he likes hoarding bits of coral and seaweed.

 At the same time, there is that rare chance you can good items, so maybe Klei should change it so that Quacken will only wake up if your trawl net happens to snatch up a rare item, like a pan flute? Then I would see why the Quacken would have a reason to wake up if some guy was stealing its good stuff. Otherwise, the dripple pipes/explosion idea still makes a bit more sense to me (in Don't Starve's case). The dripple pipes because its a magical instrument summoning a creature guarding magical items, and the explosion because its very loud and might be taken as a threat to the Quacken.

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