Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Please be aware that the content of this thread may be outdated and no longer applicable.

Mikeadatrix

How Skins Could've Been "Innocent" and Trade Inn Discussion

Recommended Posts

Asparagus    9,109
3 hours ago, JoeW said:

When the Trade Inn is added, you will be able to trade 9 of an item for an item the next tier above it, up to Spiffy -- You will not be able to trade for distinguished or elegant items. Elegant and Distinguished items are meant to be rare and special and we aim to keep it that way. 

That's for the Trade inn... I think we should first get an actual feel of what that means... do you trade your 9 commons to the game and the game gives you a spiffy? Because that would be not as bad... but if this means that the Trade Inn becomes just a place for players to trade their stuff with basically the same mechanics as Steam Trades then why make it at all? So so far, I'm leaning towards the first. 

3 hours ago, JoeW said:

In addition to that, we will be turning on marketability for items so that you can choose to sell them on the steam market rather than use them to trade up through the Trade Inn. At first, some people are going to sell too high, and some people are going to sell too low, but then things will even out as the community decides what the items are worth to them. This will allow people to better understand the value of the items that they have and let's players have more choices for how they can get different items. 

@JoeW never said YOU MUST SELL or BUY them, it's just an option... as much as everyone else is pointing out, would you really want to sell your souls to get these distinguished items?

(I would guess some will, but will you?)

I would also like to keep in mind that the skins we now have are not the last, the GoH's won't be the last too... we do have to think of the artists that have their own bills (ok, off track here bringing in other points that shouldn't be mentioned, sorry)

OK, there's too many replies coming in and I'm slow so I'll just post this now...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zeklo    17,534
Just now, Gingerbread said:

well i am currently paying 2 DST money every month for my servers and reporting bugs about both gameplay and server problems after every update. What do u do to contribute to Klei other than having couple of elegant drops by some luck? So i would never pay even 2 bucks for any cosmetics. I would go buy a good looking knife but I would never ever pay a knife cosmetics for csgo. That is my preference. This is valid for any cosmetics for any game. With this play rate i am sure at some point i can get some elegant drops as well and currently i got distiguished item. So I can sell it for 100-200 bucks too. That is not the problem. Problem that I see is making a cosmetic more valuable than a base game is being greedy for a company in my opinion. I left minecraft because it is sold to microsoft back in the days. I like klei but he seems to make mistake for making them marketable. I am even OK not even allowing elegants and distinguished items to be traded via trade inn but i am also against making them marketable. I don't want to see a greedy company only thinks of himself but not the majority of the community who really contributed to them throughout beta stage with their game hours and 30+ public servers with caves...

This might sound... well I don't know exactly, but probably not what I intend it so sound like.

I'm just not understanding the part where Klei are being greedy here I suppose? Could you expand on this? How does the change benefit them...? (I'm not being sarcastic if it seems that way)

1 minute ago, ItsPizzaTime said:

I just feel that this trade-inn isn't really solving anything. Sure I won't have as many commons as I once did, now I have all these spiffys. But, then what? Trade my spiffies for x money and hope that I have enough to get better things? I'm surely not going to wear a button shirt when I have a tux, and most others feel the same.. as for the market, this whole system is going to de-value everything below distinguished and raise the price of the rest. Especially now that the market will have actual prices and not just be based on keys.

This I can agree on, I guess.

Perhaps it's just me, but I don't see anything to solve. Maybe because the only price I'm spending on these items is time, and I deal with what I'm dealt. I won't be trading my stuff for any money (a personal choice), so I won't have to worry about it. These are just silly things to make me look fabulous and something to hope for when I open a gift. I could buy them outright, but then what is the point of the gifts in the first place (for me, some don't find it fun)? I guess there are those who will and in the end worry about it.

That just isn't me so it's hard for me to relate. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
TemporaryMan    1,483
4 minutes ago, Asparagus said:

 

@JoeW never said YOU MUST SELL or BUY them, it's just an option... as much as everyone else is pointing out, would you really want to sell your souls to get these distinguished items?

(I would guess some will, but will you?)

Selling distinguished items for souls?  Heck no.  Who's that greedy?  Souls are worth elegant, and I don't mean a poop bag either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sheauwn    90

I see that this trade inn and market stuff has caused some controversy. I think that the trade inn is solely a plus, because excess commons can be a problem.

As for the marketable items, there are many downsides*, and there are many plus** sides.

*Downsides:

-People may choose to sell their rare items for too much, shutting people who don't have much money out until prices drop.

-People may only play Don't Starve Together for the economy and possible profit.

-New items might make previous ones go to the garbage in value.

-People may think this game has become like certain other games that have economies.

 

**Plus sides

-Everyone has a convenient option to get items, even those who have trade hold.

-The items, while possibly overpriced, will have a standard, so people will hopefully not lose out on good items they didn't know they had.

-Many people enjoy games with economies. This might attract a whole new fanbase that may just make Don't Starve's popularity skyrocket.

-Klei might make more money off of the economy. This means that they can more easily provide even more quality content, as they always have.

-The skins are free for everyone, provided they are somewhat lucky. No one is forced to pay 2.49 for a chance at fortune.

 

This is just my opinion on the matter. There are many more downsides and plus sides that are of smaller importance, but the general big ones should be included here. Let me know what you all think :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ItsPizzaTime    836
4 minutes ago, Zeklo said:

This might sound... well I don't know exactly, but probably not what I intend it so sound like.

I'm just not understanding the part where Klei are being greedy here I suppose? Could you expand on this? How does the change benefit them...? (I'm not being sarcastic if it seems that way)

The fact that the steam market is now introduced into the equation even tho there are already items being priced by the community for x keys and such. The steam market is literally not needed, and i feel it's klei's way of stepping in and saying "hey we realized ya'll are trading our non-marketable skins for things worth a determined price, so we want in on that".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JoeW    26,770
17 minutes ago, Asparagus said:

That's for the Trade inn... I think we should first get an actual feel of what that means... do you trade your 9 commons to the game and the game gives you a spiffy? Because that would be not as bad... but if this means that the Trade Inn becomes just a place for players to trade their stuff with basically the same mechanics as Steam Trades then why make it at all? So so far, I'm leaning towards the first. 

You would be trading 9 common items (with the game) to get one classy, or 9 classy items to get 1 spiffy. Just to be clear. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Exhu    161
1 minute ago, JoeW said:

You would be trading 9 common items (with the game) to get one classy, or 9 classy items to get 1 spiffy. Just to be clear. 

Guys you can't trade for higher than spiffy, just to be clear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gingerbread    324
19 minutes ago, Zeklo said:

This might sound... well I don't know exactly, but probably not what I intend it so sound like.

I'm just not understanding the part where Klei are being greedy here I suppose? Could you expand on this? How does the change benefit them...? (I'm not being sarcastic if it seems that way)

If you make things marketable it will indirectly affect your company income cuz more people will tend to buy the game and leave the game on to get skins to sell on market and then this will turn into a cult. Probably Klei is aware that dst is really popular (I guess it is more popular than DS solo) and they think that it would be better to make items open to market cuz this will be having a huge impact on total copies that will be sold. There are people for csgo who makes their money from just playing the game and trading stuff. These things attract more people to buy and play the game. Some people buys the game not because they really wanna play but to make money somehow. This is extremely dangerous for a community as I don't wanna see people comin around and all their wish is to sell item in the forums and then disappear forever. I just don't wanna see a community based on only self interest. This player greediness will make a company earn more in long run for sure..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
leonseye    805
2 minutes ago, JoeW said:

You would be trading 9 common items (with the game) to get one classy, or 9 classy items to get 1 spiffy. Just to be clear. 

There has been a lot of speculation thus far in this thread talking about how these items are now being opened up to the Steam marketplace, etc.

Does this just mean that instead of just trading for other skins or keys, now people can choose to buy items outright from other players for money from their Steam wallet?

I don't personally see an issue w/ that as the items are still being given out for free just for playing a game that I already enjoy playing and have enjoyed playing w/out even the possibility of cool clothing items for years.

Also, there are other skins on the way as well?  Don't need an ETA or anything of the sort, just hoping that one day maybe I'll get my hands on that sexy Samurai Wigfrid concept that was shown a while back. :p

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, leonseye said:

Explain to me how people will no longer be able to receive skins as drops from playing the game and customize their character?

Explain to me how these skins received from playing are not still absolutely free to everyone?

Because what you're talking about does not impede the skins feature in any way, shape, or form.  There is nothing unfair about it.

Rare skin drops are clearly intended to remain rare, that's why they are... y'know, rare.  And when you get one, whether through playing the game or trading, you can at least feel somewhat special for having one.

They will still receive drops, that's indisputable. I never said they weren't free for everyone either too to be clear. The issue here is that people are unable to get the skins that they actually want (regardless of if they want it for the skin's meaning in the game or they want to sell it for a bloody huge profit) because there will be a set price of everything already. Your happiness you derive from the skins part of the game will basically become either impossible or the death of your wallet. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
leonseye    805
1 minute ago, Gingerbread said:

If you make things marketable it will indirectly affect your company income cuz more people will tend to buy the game and leave the game on to get skins to sell on market and then this will turn into a cult. Probably Klei is aware that dst is really popular (I guess it is more popular than DS solo) and they think that it would be better to make items open to market. There are people for csgo who makes their money from just playing the game and trading stuff. These things attract more people to buy and play the game. Some people buys the game not because they really wanna play but to make money somehow. This is extremely dangerous for a community as I don't wanna see people comin around and all their wish is to sell item in the forums and then disappear forever. I just don't wanna see a community based on only self interest. This player greediness will make a company earn more in long run for sure..

I feel like DST already has a great community and that just because the types of players that you describe may ALSO choose to play DST in the future, that doesn't mean that those who are playing the game for fun will all just simply disappear.

Especially as DST servers are generally small, many are passworded and friends-only.

I know that if somebody buys this game and leaves it on to sell skins in the future, this doesn't effect my gameplay in any sort of tangible way whatsoever.  They aren't coming onto MY server, they aren't AFK'ing at MY portal, and they aren't stopping ME from getting Elegant / Distinguished items.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zeklo    17,534
Just now, Gingerbread said:

If you make things marketable it will indirectly affect your company income cuz more people will tend to buy the game and leave the game on to get skins to sell on market and then this will turn into a cult. Probably Klei is aware that dst is really popular (I guess it is more popular than DS solo) and they think that it would be better to make items open to market. There are people for csgo who makes their money from just playing the game and trading stuff. These things attract more people to buy and play the game. Some people buys the game not because they really wanna play but to make money somehow. This is extremely dangerous for a community as I don't wanna see people comin around and all their wish is to sell item in the forums and then disappear forever. I just don't wanna see a community based on only self interest. This player greediness will make a company earn more in long run for sure..

Ah, I get it. I can't imagine the skins selling for that much, but I don't have the knowledge nor expertise in this area to say for sure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Zeklo said:

I'm just not understanding the part where Klei are being greedy here I suppose? Could you expand on this? How does the change benefit them...? (I'm not being sarcastic if it seems that way)

 

Klei basically has a huge incentive to create an officiated market on skins because they will make a share of the revenue for each transaction enacted... I am not against profit or anything like that, I believe Klei should become a popular game company; just on the grounds of its creativity, design, and excellent quality work, not the panning out and cycling of skins to generate revenue. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sheauwn    90
1 minute ago, Zeklo said:

Ah, I get it. I can't imagine the skins selling for that much, but I don't have the knowledge nor expertise in this area to say for sure.

Usually items get sold for too low and too high for a while until they come to a middle point. Then, they start to decline.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
leonseye    805
4 minutes ago, thegreatmanagement said:

Your happiness you derive from the skins part of the game will basically become either impossible or the death of your wallet. 

It's not impossible now, so it stands to reason that it will not somehow become impossible just because other people are selling them for money.

You're making a rather illogical jump here.

Can we please stop exaggerating so heavily?  It's really very hard to take things seriously when you're attempting to so obviously skew things in favor of your own argument.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WillowCrocker    698

I don't understand.

I attend every weekly stream, and I remember verbatim you guys saying that skins were NOT going to be marketable. I dunno. I trust Klei don't get me wrong, but...something about this just feels...wrong? Especially after promising that they WOUDLN'T be marketable. Because everyone is right - the market is going to be INSANE.

Bummer, honestly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, leonseye said:

It's not impossible now, so it stands to reason that it will not somehow become impossible just because other people are selling them for money.

You're making a rather illogical jump here.

That's true, it's not impossible. But at the same time, there is still a huge cost for it though. Is it fair to someone who has money to enjoy a game more than someone else who doesn't have the money to? What are you going to say to them? This is a rich man's game? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zeklo    17,534
1 minute ago, thegreatmanagement said:

That's true, it's not impossible. But at the same time, there is still a huge cost for it though. Is it fair to someone who has money to enjoy a game more than someone else who doesn't have the money to? What are you going to say to them? This is a rich man's game? 

I agreed up until the bolded part.

Don't get me wrong, I'm an addict collector, but in no way does not looking as fabulous as someone else make me enjoy the game less. That isn't to say others don't I suppose, but honestly... that's their issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
leonseye    805
3 minutes ago, thegreatmanagement said:

That's true, it's not impossible. But at the same time, there is still a huge cost for it though. Is it fair to someone who has money to enjoy a game more than someone else who doesn't have the money to? What are you going to say to them? This is a rich man's game? 

I'm not seeing the correlation between having a skin and enjoying the game itself, personally.

The skins don't mechanically change anything at all, and the VAST majority of the "desirable" skins are not even visible most of the time (upper body skins covered by armors, fancy GoH hairs covered by helmets, etc).

Wigfrid is still going to kill a spider w/ a spear in 2 hits, no matter what gloves or backpack she's wearing.

Wickerbottom is still going to craft a tentacle book whether she's wearing makeup or not.

Deerclops is still going to come and try to wreck your winter base whether you're wearing a formal tuxedo or a lumberjack shirt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Zeklo said:

I agreed up until the bolded part.

Don't get me wrong, I'm an addict collector, but in no way does not looking as fabulous as someone else make me enjoy the game less. That isn't to say others don't I suppose, but honestly... that's their issue.

I didn't mean it would make the actual gameplay less. It's more that it's making a well intended additional feature of the game cater unfairly to different people who play the game. It's creating an exclusive benefit that only very people can equitably enjoy; it's like if everyone in your city was getting a tax return. If only a select group of them got a tax return of $10000 more than you did even though you both pay the same taxes, wouldn't that bother you? Yeah everyone's getting money back still, but the main point is that it's not fair to the majority. 

3 minutes ago, leonseye said:

I'm not seeing the correlation between having a skin and enjoying the game itself, personally.

The skins don't mechanically change anything at all, and the VAST majority of the "desirable" skins are not even visible most of the time (upper body skins covered by armors, fancy GoH hairs covered by helmets, etc).

The skins are an additional part of the game that many people at the moment legitimately enjoy - it's a nice thing to have. Wigfrid and her Guest of Honor still make me smile every time I just see her set because she is my favorite character, and we've had great memories together. For me, if someone else is jarred from enjoying this or something like this because of the simple reason they can't afford it, that's where I call absolute hogwash. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sheauwn    90
6 minutes ago, WillowCrocker said:

I don't understand.

I attend every weekly stream, and I remember verbatim you guys saying that skins were NOT going to be marketable. I dunno. I trust Klei don't get me wrong, but...something about this just feels...wrong? Especially after promising that they WOUDLN'T be marketable. Because everyone is right - the market is going to be INSANE.

Bummer, honestly.

I think it would be a mistake to drop the market now. A big one actually. If the market drops while new skins are being introduced, then the older items will suffer.

However, if Klei waits and lets a few "collections" come out, a steam market system could work after the item variety is developed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
WillowCrocker    698
Just now, Sheauwn said:

I think it would be a mistake to drop the market now. A big one actually. If the market drops while new skins are being introduced, then the older items will suffer.

However, if Klei waits and lets a few "collections" come out, a steam market system could work after the item variety is developed.

But see, thing is, there are at least two more rarities coming out as far as we know that have been confirmed. You know there's going to be at LEAST one person who goes out of their way to try to sell for a ridiculous amount of money and then other people will blindly follow. 

This entire predicament is a matter of opinion, really. However when we're already under the impression that skins will not be marketable, and then they change their mind and do it despite already telling us that...well, it's a little upsetting I suppose. 

I just hope skins don't turn into some kind of cash-cow. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zeklo    17,534
Just now, thegreatmanagement said:

I didn't mean it would make the actual gameplay less. It's more that it's making a well intended additional feature of the game cater unfairly to different people who play the game. It's creating an exclusive benefit that only very people can equitably enjoy; it's like if everyone in your city was getting a tax return. If only a select group of them got a tax return of $10000 more than you did even though you both pay the same taxes, wouldn't that bother you? Yeah everyone's getting money back still, but the main point is that it's not fair to the majority.

There is always a factor that will make something unfair. As I stated in a different discussion here, say I can only play 1 hours a day compared to someone who can play 8 hours a day. Suddenly I might not even get as many drops. Is that to be considered fair? Perhaps I'm comparing apples to oranges, but the both of them are still fruit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gingerbread    324

If Klei really makes the items marketable, I will not be in the forums.. I will stop having Gingerbread Cookies servers too. I wish a good luck to Klei with new community they wanna build.

I will also sell my distinguished item whenever it is marketable. Good luck with that Klei.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites