Imagine a real life bearger!

[XirmiX]

It is possible thought eith genetic engineering, by giving badger's DNA to a grizzly bear but the baby when grown would still not be as big as the DS one. Man, if anybody can do genetical engineering here (which I doubt) be the first person to create a real life bearger, ei?

[Battal]

I don't think you know how genetic engineering works.

[ThePreChewedTree]

http://rsz_abaa-cute-baby-bear.jpg

[LadyAzure]

I am pretty sure that doesnt work unless the species are very close related, you couldn't for example put a horse with a cat..or a bird and a frog, they have to be very very close DNA wise to do that and I am not sure that they are. In the past attempts have been made to do such things and it ends up bad with mutations and dead babies instead of the intended purpose.

[Warewolves]

I am pretty sure that doesnt work unless the species are very close related, you couldn't for example put a horse with a cat..or a bird and a frog, they have to be very very close DNA wise to do that and I am not sure that they are. In the past attempts have been made to do such things and it ends up bad with mutations and dead babies instead of the intended purpose.

 

What about Ligers?

[LadyAzure]

Yes tigers and lions work but they naturally have mated on their own, humans didn't do that first. Its the same reason we have donkeys those are a cross between horses and mules I believe...been a year since I took Biology so don't quote me. 

[Tamazacat]

What about Ligers?

Lions and tigers are pretty closely related: they are both along the same evolutionary branch and their Genus is classified, by genome, as Panthera (basically big cats).

 

Tiger's Latin name is Panthera tigris, and a lion's Latin name is Panthera leo (or P. tigris and P. leo for short)

 

Because they are so genetically similar, they are able to produce offspring - but this offspring is infertile. This is due to the chromosomes, in Layman's terms, mismatching - they aren't identical in the right places.

 

In terms of bears and badgers... well... our chromosomes hold alleles which are made up of DNA. If our chromosomes were altered they, theoretically, have the potential to not be "us", if you get what I mean.

 

Bears come under the Genus Ursidae, whereas a badger's Genus is classified as Mustelidae. Because of the almost complete incompatibility of their chromosomes, they cannot produce any offspring.

 

Another example would be a wild horse (Equus ferus) which has 66 chromosomes, and a donkey (Equus asinus - prepare for laughter!) which has 62 chromosomes. Because they share a branch on the phylogenetic tree, their chromosomes match on the correct places, so they can produce a mule (horse+donkey offspring). Again, this mule is infertile because the chromosomes did not match up during meiosis.

 

Hope this cleared things up for you a bit!

 

If you want me to take things a bit slower and/or explain what things are, don't hesitate to ask!

Biology = science win. Remember that.

Physicists might say they're better, but pffffft! Who needs to know about the life cycle of stars when we don't know about our own planet? (Lol, jokes)

[CaptainClam]

Yes tigers and lions work but they naturally have mated on their own, humans didn't do that first. Its the same reason we have donkeys those are a cross between horses and mules I believe...been a year since I took Biology so don't quote me. 

Actually, mules are a cross between horses and donkeys.

[LadyAzure]

Actually, mules are a cross between horses and donkeys.

Like I said don't quote me on it....and you went and quoted meh..anyway at least I remember enough in class that badgers and bears can't create offspring yay for me.

[rsrs]

It is possible thought eith genetic engineering, by giving badger's DNA to a grizzly bear but the baby when grown would still not be as big as the DS one. Man, if anybody can do genetical engineering here (which I doubt) be the first person to create a real life bearger, ei?

 

The only thing that would be probably possible is to transfer a few genes from a badger to a grizzly. This may give the bear some badger-like traits, but because the majority of traits are polygenic (they are caused by several genes, not just one) and there is still not much understanding how the majority of traits are generated depending on genes (not even for humans, let alone for grizzly or badger) it will be currently impossible to transfer specific traits from badger to bear.

 

As it was already stated, a complete hybrid between bear and badger cannot be generated as the genomes are incompatible. With ligers this is different, they can even spontaneously create hybrids in captivity without any genetic engineering.

 

And people also need to understand how genetic engineering works. Genetic engineers are not (usually) evil scientists working in their private underground bases. The research is done at universities or private companies, which means that you need external funding (it is unlikely that you get funding for generating a bearger) and you usually also need an ethical approval by ethical committees (I don't think there are many DS players on these committees).

[XirmiX]

I am pretty sure that doesnt work unless the species are very close related, you couldn't for example put a horse with a cat..or a bird and a frog, they have to be very very close DNA wise to do that and I am not sure that they are. In the past attempts have been made to do such things and it ends up bad with mutations and dead babies instead of the intended purpose.

Well, Jelly fish DNA worked on Rats, who are completely different types of species. Of course the animal would have diseases, but just because they are not the same type of species doesn't mean that an animal of the two can't be created.

[LadyAzure]

I think what you are referring to was a gene transfer done with mice and jellyfish, they produced traits of the jellyfish but they did not conbine two different species and make a new one, they were still mice, not jellymice lol

[rsrs]

Well, Jelly fish DNA worked on Rats, who are completely different types of species. Of course the animal would have diseases ...

 

In this case, only one gene was transferred (GFP). They did not create a hybrid of jellyfish and rat, they only transferred one gene from a jellyfish to a different species. Which, as I said in my previous post, is possible (although not as easy as many people imagine). As I said in my previous post, the majority of traits are determined by multiple genes. Therefore they are not so easy to transfer as the GFP in the jellyfish example. You were talking about the hybrid of the bear and badger, which is a very different thing from transferring one gene. Therefore the jellyfish example is completely different from this situation.

 

 

... but just because they are not the same type of species doesn't mean that an animal of the two can't be created.

 

I do not want to be nitpicking, but you are using the word species incorrectly. Example of two individuals of the same species are two grizzly bears. They are hybridizable, because they are the same species with the same chromosome number. Individuals of two different species (like lions and tigers) can also be hybridizable, but only when they are not genetically very dissimilar (chromosome number, etc.). Even if you forcibly fuse specific generative cells of incompatible species, they will not generate hybrid species. It does not work like in the films. The result will be completely inviable and will never start to replicate into a complete organism. With plants, you would be more successful, as there is much more interspecies compatibility.

[The Letter W]

I almost got out the photoshop.

Almost. 

Already made a Goose/Moose. 

[XirmiX]

In this case, only one gene was transferred (GFP). They did not create a hybrid of jellyfish and rat, they only transferred one gene from a jellyfish to a different species. Which, as I said in my previous post, is possible (although not as easy as many people imagine). As I said in my previous post, the majority of traits are determined by multiple genes. Therefore they are not so easy to transfer as the GFP in the jellyfish example. You were talking about the hybrid of the bear and badger, which is a very different thing from transferring one gene. Therefore the jellyfish example is completely different from this situation.

 

 

 

I do not want to be nitpicking, but you are using the word species incorrectly. Example of two individuals of the same species are two grizzly bears. They are hybridizable, because they are the same species with the same chromosome number. Individuals of two different species (like lions and tigers) can also be hybridizable, but only when they are not genetically very dissimilar (chromosome number, etc.). Even if you forcibly fuse specific generative cells of incompatible species, they will not generate hybrid species. It does not work like in the films. The result will be completely inviable and will never start to replicate into a complete organism. With plants, you would be more successful, as there is much more interspecies compatibility.

 

If only one gene transfered is possible: that's all we need, man! If one gene made the whole skin of a rat green-and-glowy then making part of a Grizzly bear's fur into a Badger fur and may be making the shape of the bear's face more like badger's should be possible! That's all that's needed from the badger DNA to create a Bearger: Grizzly with a few features of a badger, nothing more! It's not like we'll ever create a fully sized Bearger, now will we: and what chaos would that make?!

 

I'm not good at identifying words I don't often use, okay...

[Lonestarr01]

Haven't you seen that south park episode?

 

A pig and an elephants DNA just wont splice. 

 

   <some reference xD

[XirmiX]

So... How do you know Bear and a Badger DNA won't work together?

[debugman18]

So... How do you know Bear and a Badger DNA won't work together?

 

Because their DNA is different enough that it wouldn't work. Another telling sign is that there isn't a Bearger in real life, while things like Mules and Ligers actually happen naturally.

 

DNA is not legos.

[rsrs]

If only one gene transfered is possible: that's all we need, man! If one gene made the whole skin of a rat green-and-glowy then making part of a Grizzly bear's fur into a Badger fur and may be making the shape of the bear's face more like badger's should be possible! That's all that's needed from the badger DNA to create a Bearger: Grizzly with a few features of a badger, nothing more! It's not like we'll ever create a fully sized Bearger, now will we: and what chaos would that make?!

 

I'm not good at identifying words I don't often use, okay...

 

It is highly unlikely that badger's fur colouration is caused by single gene. As I said, the majority of traits are encoded by multiple genes. I don't even think that both grizzly and badger have been sequenced, so we don't know they complete DNA sequence.

 

Badgers and bears do not have the same chromosome number and structure. Explained in very simple terms, if you try to completely hybridize species like bears and badgers, the resulting embryo will never start to replicate into a complete animal, because misalignment of chromosomes and various other phenomena will not allow it. Even if the species are extremely similar and the embryo starts to grow, you usually get a mixture of cells without a reasonable structural organization and therefore it will never live and function like an animal.

 

Also, you seem to think that genetic engineers produce hybrids of animals in their free time. As I already said earlier, it does not work like that. I have done genetic engineering before (although not in animals, because that is usually not worth the effort), but you just cannot come to the laboratory and start generating bearger. You need to have funding for your research project (I cannot imagine any grant agency that will give you funding for generating bearger), you need an ethical approval (may be slightly problematic in this case), you need bear and badger cells and somebody that will extract them ethically and somebody who will allow you to do this on their bears or badgers and so on.

[XirmiX]

It is highly unlikely that badger's fur colouration is caused by single gene. As I said, the majority of traits are encoded by multiple genes. I don't even think that both grizzly and badger have been sequenced, so we don't know they complete DNA sequence.

 

Badgers and bears do not have the same chromosome number and structure. Explained in very simple terms, if you try to completely hybridize species like bears and badgers, the resulting embryo will never start to replicate into a complete animal, because misalignment of chromosomes and various other phenomena will not allow it. Even if the species are extremely similar and the embryo starts to grow, you usually get a mixture of cells without a reasonable structural organization and therefore it will never live and function like an animal.

 

Also, you seem to think that genetic engineers produce hybrids of animals in their free time. As I already said earlier, it does not work like that. I have done genetic engineering before (although not in animals, because that is usually not worth the effort), but you just cannot come to the laboratory and start generating bearger. You need to have funding for your research project (I cannot imagine any grant agency that will give you funding for generating bearger), you need an ethical approval (may be slightly problematic in this case), you need bear and badger cells and somebody that will extract them ethically and somebody who will allow you to do this on their bears or badgers and so on.

Okay, got it, I understand how this goes around, btw. So the way life works, is a bit like programming; make a program the way you don't want it to work or do something wrong and it will just not work.

[rsrs]

Okay, got it, I understand how this goes around, btw. So the way life works, is a bit like programming; make a program the way you don't want it to work or do something wrong and it will just not work.

Exactly, DNA is basically a "programme" that controls to some extent how the organism looks like, how to build the internal organs, how should the anatomy look like, how to build the proteins and enzymes the organism uses, how to make the muscles in a way that they can do some physical work and many other things. If you actually read DNA of organisms that have been sequenced, you can represent the sequence as a string of four letters (nucleotides). Sometimes if a single of these letters gets changed, you will get a serious disorder (like cystic fibrosis). And in this case, only a single letter has been changed. But sometimes you can alter a significant proportion of the sequence without producing virtually any effect. Everything depends on the position in the genome and the nature of the change.

[Tamazacat]

Xirimi, if you're interested in this stuff, I highly recommend pursuing biology (even for a wee bit). It gives you a great understanding of our natural (and genetically modified) world

 

Did you know that lots of people are afraid of genetically modified (GM) foods?

A lot of people won't touch the stuff - I'm not sure why, though. I can only think that it's from a fear of the unknown.

Most of your tomatoes are GM - hence they don't go off as quickly; they don't splatter the same way like when people throw them in cartoons/in old movies

 

It's worth having a wee look into!

[Vanderer]

Regardless of what science can do now, I am sure in the future, no matter how long it takes, they will find a way to somehow freak up the rest of nature in awesome/horrifying ways. Personally, I want a dragon like thing. Kimodo dragons aren't dragon enough for me....And fully grown cats that look just like young baby tigers.....

The world would be a awesome/cuddlier place.

And yes, a Bearger would be darned scary. I mean, badgers are pretty scary now as they are, but with a bear? Arrrrgh.....

[rsrs]

Regardless of what science can do now, I am sure in the future, no matter how long it takes, they will find a way to somehow freak up the rest of nature in awesome/horrifying ways. Personally, I want a dragon like thing. Kimodo dragons aren't dragon enough for me....And fully grown cats that look just like young baby tigers.....

The world would be a awesome/cuddlier place.

And yes, a Bearger would be darned scary. I mean, badgers are pretty scary now as they are, but with a bear? Arrrrgh.....

 

The world will definitely not be an awesome place if these animals escaped into natural ecosystems. Introductions of alien species into their non-native ecosystems has already created horrible damage to many places in the world. For example, the introduction of zebra mussels to the UK has killed a large amount of native mussels and they are also clogging pipes, which native mussels don't do. So the damage is both ecological and economical.

[Vanderer]

The world will definitely not be an awesome place if these animals escaped into natural ecosystems. Introductions of alien species into their non-native ecosystems has already created horrible damage to many places in the world. For example, the introduction of zebra mussels to the UK has killed a large amount of native mussels and they are also clogging pipes, which native mussels don't do. So the damage is both ecological and economical.

 

I was being sarcastic, Hah hah, but yeah, I see ya point.