Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Please be aware that the content of this thread may be outdated and no longer applicable.

TheHomeChicken

Willow Needs A Buff

Recommended Posts

InaneDugong    121

This is going to sound rude, but I honestly gather that most the characters are balanced for nubs. Like, 'immunity to night' - who cares about that? Haven't you all played the last mission of Adventure? Immunity to night isn't something I want.

Let's bring this into perspective: a torch is 2/2 twig grass. It acts identically to Willow's lighter (minus dapper aura). 2/2. You can't fight with a torch; you can't fight with a lighter. The lighter is just there for dapper aura and if you go full retard. Once again: you cannot fight with lighter, and the aura doesn't scale, so any T2 science or alch dapper gear is more effective than the lighter and frees up a hand. On top of that, you can fight with the T2 dapper gear (and, if you want armour, sure, you have to remove the gear, but you have to remove the lighter to fight too).

Then you've got wes and his 5 damage ability on his 150 sanity cap. Again, novel for first 10 days then drops off.

Then you've got bulls%+t like WX and his 150\300\400 or somethinh end game stats and hia lightning lighter and speed and health regen, and for what detriment? He is as weak as as Wes and Willow as far as the first 20 days of nothing is concerned.

Dunno, for a game that has scaling, I'd never take half the characters if this were a moba.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Doomfan64    187

Someone suggested that, since lighter fluid can be used to start a fire, Willow shouldn't have to use grass in certain recipes. I'm not sure if this would fit but I can see it being very useful for recipes requiring rope, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
InaneDugong    121

Like, firestaff and firedarts could be stronger. Or her lighter could start stronger fires, or anything struck by a Willow-created fire could be lit on fire.

Or the lighter could reveal a decent area - as illogical as that may be.

Tonnes of stuff could be done but, alas, everyone reckons she's balanced.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hazelbytes    0

I'm still on the stance that Willow should have complete overheating resistance and a harder time in winter. I know I'm like the only person who thinks like that, but still.

 

i think that makes a lot of sense. i remember when i first started playing, i loved Willow because i found her perks so useful but since becoming more experienced and playing as other characters, playing a game with her at this point just feels a bit lacking, particularly in RoG.

 

i think taking her pyrocentric (a word i just made up)  perks and drawbacks to that extreme would match the intensity of Reign of Giants, and instead of Willow just inspiring my nostalgia, she'd be a character i'd really want to play again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hugos10    52

So, you're saying Willow can easily fight enemies without so much as lifting a finger?

*Cough* Webber *Cough*

 

Seriously though, spiders are much better fighting than using fire. SPIDERS, for example, can't burn down your whole base.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
CycloneSP    15

Hmm, even after trying webber, I still come back to willow. I just find her easier to manage than the other characters, dunno why, I just like her. That being said, I don't think she should be immune to overheating. And resistance to overheating makes little sense, since it's not 'fire'

 

Also, to whomever said you can't fight with her lighter obviously doesn't play much willow. As her lighter makes for a great backup weapon if your spear breaks in the middle of combat. Yes it does noticeably less dmg, but it has the same attack speed as any other weapon, just like the walking cane. Also, her lighter is great to attack spider dens and bee hives to save on your other tools' durability.

 

Again, I feel that the biggest nerf to willow in RoG was having many items made from stone (alchemy engine, crockpot, etc) become flammable. As most ppl place those things near their fire pit, and when being dropped to low sanity, one normally runs to their fire pit, puts a few logs in and puts on their most dapper outfit in an attempt to regain sanity. However, due to her "perk" while you sit there trying to become sane, you end up setting your whole base aflame.

 

That being said, I don't think that is such a bad thing. It's annoying, but it adds an interesting element to her play. But I -would- like to see some kind of compensation for it.

 

Perhaps a willow only craftable item, like wigfrid? Perhaps something like a "firebomb"?

 

the recipe could look something like this: gunpowder + papyrus + crimson feather

 

It is thrown with similar range to that or the boomerang and/or blowdarts. When it lands/hits it explodes like gunpowder, doing a hefty amount of dmg, and could possibly light surroundings on fire.

 

Thoughts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MeingroessterFan    4,139

Dunno, for a game that has scaling, I'd never take half the characters if this were a moba.

 

If this were a moba, there's no chance in hell that I'd play it :p

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Avarwen    44

I think it should take a bit longer to over heat in summer while in winter you should freeze much quicker it would make sense Willow is immune to fire after all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Frantz93    0

From my experience, Willow's perks and item are really useful only in survival mode with the "lights out" modifier

Despite it should be nice to have other/better perks, the ability to survive in this case in a much more easy way than other char is enough good in order to justify her appareantly bad abilities

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kirihime    13

This is going to sound rude, but I honestly gather that most the characters are balanced for nubs. Like, 'immunity to night' - who cares about that? Haven't you all played the last mission of Adventure? Immunity to night isn't something I want.

Let's bring this into perspective: a torch is 2/2 twig grass. It acts identically to Willow's lighter (minus dapper aura). 2/2. You can't fight with a torch; you can't fight with a lighter. The lighter is just there for dapper aura and if you go full retard. Once again: you cannot fight with lighter, and the aura doesn't scale, so any T2 science or alch dapper gear is more effective than the lighter and frees up a hand. On top of that, you can fight with the T2 dapper gear (and, if you want armour, sure, you have to remove the gear, but you have to remove the lighter to fight too).

Then you've got wes and his 5 damage ability on his 150 sanity cap. Again, novel for first 10 days then drops off.

Then you've got bulls%+t like WX and his 150\300\400 or somethinh end game stats and hia lightning lighter and speed and health regen, and for what detriment? He is as weak as as Wes and Willow as far as the first 20 days of nothing is concerned.

Dunno, for a game that has scaling, I'd never take half the characters if this were a moba.

 

The thing is, some characters in this game are meant to be better or worse than others. I play Wes because I like the added challenge he brings, not because I want to build balloon traps - those are just a fun gimmick.

 

That said, I do think Willow needs a buff, one that actually makes her play differently to the other characters. At the moment, all of her abilities effectively do nothing - the lighter is just an infinite, but weak torch with a tiny sanity bonus, I can't remember the last time I took fire damage as any character, and the sanity from fire thing sucks because of her lower sanity cap, and there's not much else you can do while standing next to a fire to regain it. There's no reason you'd want to play her, not even for a challenge, she's just Wilson minus the beard and 80 sanity.

 

What I'd recommend to improve her, is make her deal much more fire damage, ideally at least double. Not only would this give a use to the otherwise mediocre fire darts and staff, but she'd also have a niche in being able to kill bosses easily, at the cost of some drops.

 

Also, the sanity aura from fires could be replaced by (or combined with?) getting sanity whenever she light things on fire - depending on the fuel value of the object maybe? say, +10 sanity for each tree burned. It'd go nicely with fire darts and my previous suggestion, and give the player an actual reason to play like a pyromaniac.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Brianman27    52

We could get into a subject of infinite darts or a magic fire, but that goes for Willow, I want wickerbottom books that are also unbreakable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
InaneDugong    121

The thing is, some characters in this game are meant to be better or worse than others. I play Wes because I like the added challenge he brings, not because I want to build balloon traps - those are just a fun gimmick.

 

I really disagree. Really, really disagree. I understand your requirement to have a challenge, but that's got more to do with the state of the game than the characters' load-outs. 

 

I think that settings should be available for players like you so that you can maintain a challenge no matter what character you play, however this requires a degree of balance within the game first. Without that balance, you're really just playing on the fundamental difficulties of the game to find any sort of challenge (like a character that literally has no stats and perks), and this isn't much of an ode to the integrity of the game.

 

I can get that same kind of difficulty out of ProfFarnsWorth's mod if I really want (all creatures scale continuously as the game goes on). That is available for you, you know? 

 

Point is, this is kinda your agenda, and it's important to consider it objectively. Asking not to fix a character because it's the only one that sucks enough for you to have any kind of challenge already sounds shady, and your support is needed just to get it fixed in the first place. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
avilmask    104

Just imagine a guy in fireproof suite. You can burn him with a flamethrower, and most likely he will not die from burns, he will be cooked from inside. Is a difference between burning and heating. And taking into account the fact she is getting sanity from COLD fire, she enjoys burning, not actual heating.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Frantz93    0

what if, as another perk, she could fire monsters and have the "not burnt" loot (like, for example, loots are fireproof for 2-3 seconds)? Sure, it has no real sense, but it will change the way to play willow (and stimulate a way to play her)

it should not be too op simply because, doing it so much, you will risk to burn yoo much resources (especially because, in RoG, nearly all is flammable)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lonestarr01    187

She is fine the way she is. A fast way to get sanity and invulnerable to fire are good enough perks. She doesn't need anymore. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Foa    7

Does she get damaged when she tries to extinguish things that start to burn in summer?

 

If so it would be an oversight because that's literally fire damage, which Willow is supposed to be immune to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kirihime    13

She is fine the way she is. A fast way to get sanity and invulnerable to fire are good enough perks. She doesn't need anymore. 

 It's not a fast way to get sanity, though, plus there's not much else you can do (other than cook food) while raising it, since you need to be right next to the fire for a decent rate. Compared to wearing a top hat, or even just picking flowers, it's nigh useless. Especially with her decreased sanity cap.

 

As for the fire damage immunity, fire just isn't a threat. It's easy to avoid, you've got about a second of warning before you start taking damage, and armour reduces the damage to next to nothing anyway.

 

The lighter is just a torch with a tiny (0.6/min) sanity boost, and a significantly decreased radius. Sure, it's got infinite fuel, but given how cheap torches are, and that you'll be switching to the Lantern/Mining helmet anyway, what's the point?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Silane    39

Just tossing my two cents in here.

 

I think that she needs something else.    Compared to other characters, in a rather broad way:

 

Wilson - Basic char, perk easiest char to craft meat effigies and a beard the is shavable, the adds a bonus in winter.   (No real negative)

Wendy- Char gets a "summoning" item that can summon a second ally that can regenerate.   Ally has friendly fire and only helps at night.   (No real negative)

Wigfrid - Strong character, earns sanity from battles, and battle gear.  (Can't eat veggies)

Wes - Weak character, Balloon traps, and lower stats.  (No "unique" negative)

Mawxwell - Easy character. High sanity, unique gear, shadow summoning.   (No negative aside from summoning restriction)

Woody -Basic char, unique tool.  Changes into a Were Beaver during full moons.  (Negative no Glommer/control of Werebeaver form)

WX-8 - Can eat rotten food, can upgrade himself for better stats. (Gets environmental damages)

Wickerbottom - Only character that can have/use books.  (Negative can't sleep)

Wolfgang - Gets stronger on a full stomach.  (Is afraid of the dark)

 

Willow - Fire immunity and a Sweet lighter, gains small sanity from fires.   Negative: sets thing on fire when low on sanity.  Lower general stat with no stat upgrades.

 

Honestly the lighter pales in comparison to any of the other unique character gear.   Even Woody's Lucy is more effective than the basic axe.

 

And of all everyone's "unique" negatives Willow's is the only one that seems to be truly dangerously/unavoidably unnecessary.

 

 

Now before I go on I only ever play as Willow.  Personally I love her design and I myself am a Pyro, so I love to play as her and barely venture into the other characters.     

 

Many characters negatives though are minuscule or redundant at best.  Can't sleep?   Can't eat veggies?  Afraid of the Dark?  Turns into a monster?   Weak?    Non of these could potentially ruin your entire base or resources.  (Well maybe Woody's)  Whilst with Willow I actively try to keep her sanity up so that she won't set everything on fire.  Effectively kicking the appearance of beardlings/beardlords.

 

And her lighter?   I mean common!   I know lighters aren't that horribly useful in RL, but given the technical size of her lighter and the DS world, that should;t even matter.   As it is building a torch, better heat/light, is far more effective than the lighter in just about every situation.  At least Woody's Lucy, Wickerbottoms books, Wigfrid gear and Maxwells gear, are better than general gear and have a prolonged in-game use.

 

 

I don't really care about adding brand new thing to Willow.  But fixing ever so slightly her existing build would be nice.  

 

(Again I don't really play other characters and I'm not saying Willow needs to be fixed to play her.) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MrTeHe101    21

Willow needs more of a buff. He lighter is pretty useless when you can make a torch. She isn't unique in that fact then. The only good thing about willow is sanity gain near fire. Other than that, she isn't a whole lot unique.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
avilmask    104

She is a newbie friendly character, she was like this from the start, and she doing her job very well.


She is a newbie friendly character, she was like this from the start, and she doing her job very well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lonestarr01    187

On Day 1 you can go a full day cycle, night and duck included, without losing ANY sanity with Willow. Without picking flowers too. No other character can do that. No other character generates sanity while you're sitting there at night. Or sitting there in winter. She doesn't need a buff XD 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kirihime    13

She is a newbie friendly character, she was like this from the start, and she doing her job very well.

That doesn't mean she should become a worthless character as soon as you can manage torches.

 

 

On Day 1 you can go a full day cycle, night and duck included, without losing ANY sanity with Willow. Without picking flowers too. No other character can do that. No other character generates sanity while you're sitting there at night. Or sitting there in winter. She doesn't need a buff XD 

Or you could pick another character, do whatever you want at night and chances are you'll still end up with more sanity than willow's max.

 

Also, all characters (aside from Wickerbottom) can get sanity at night. It's called sleeping.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lonestarr01    187

That doesn't mean she should become a worthless character as soon as you can manage torches.

 

 

Or you could pick another character, do whatever you want at night and chances are you'll still end up with more sanity than willow's max.

 

Also, all characters (aside from Wickerbottom) can get sanity at night. It's called sleeping.

 

I know you can sleep -.- At the cost of hunger. Willow doesnt need to do so, another reason she needs no buff. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites