Lumine04

"Every character sucks" ...not really

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FourthLess    288
8 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

I’m just going to wildly assume you’ve never played any RPG ever.

Rpg is rpg and survival sandbox game is a survival sandbox game, they're different things. 

The main I reason I dislike Wendy is not because she simply has a summon but because of how little to no effort is required from you to use it. You can summon and unsummon it at any point, if it dies it's immediately starts to regenerate. While having more control over Abigail is nice, I was not a fun of new easier way to summon her. It wasn't difficult before but at least it was some kind of work you had to do. Also yeah, still hate the damage boos thing that has no reason to exist. 

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Notecja    3005

I dislike Abigail, because she is dumb and stinky (stinky ectoplasm) and kills little animals like wobsters, rabbits (carrats too?) without even being in attack mode (YES. You need to maintain Abigal, to those who think you don't have to. Or she will try kill something that is too big for her or something you don't want to kill). While Wendy's depression and dark humor are not necessary that far, Abigail used to be very cheerful person... So I don't get why she turned so evil to kill innocent rabbit just because it was on her way.

Walter is smoll, ugly, stinky and dumb. The first thing, how ineffecivevis his slingshot. Just buff it klei, don't be scared. Then his so random bee allergy, like he didn't had already gamechanging downside. The difference in his head shape between his cinematic and game - I prefer that one from cinematic.

Wes, because he is slower with collecting resources. All debuffs are fine, but that one is just boring and tendious. 

Wilson, because Devs probably will give some dumb and stinky reasons to not rework him, while he need some funny tools and toys for later in game. 

Edited by Notecja
typos
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Faintly Macabre    1272

So, like

I'm not going to pretend that Wendy is some terribly high skill-cap character because it's just not true. But there is an art to using her most effectively. And she does trivialize some stuff, but it's mostly stuff that's... honestly pretty trivial already? Who's struggling to clear up spider camps? You can literally trap them all to death. Yes, it makes them a little easier than they should be for inexperienced players and can keep those players from improving, but I don't really believe in the "noob trap," simply because I feel like most players that won't branch out from that style of play were never going to get very far anyway.

As for Abigail's debuff, while I think the multiplier could probably stand to be tuned down a bit, taking advantage of it in the most impactful situations -- boss fights -- does in fact come as a trade-off: it forces you to either tank bosses (which can be very dangerous), or be ridiculously good at micro-managing Abigail. If you try to dodge boss attacks with Abigail out, she'll end up taking all those hits unarmored right on the chin and won't last very long at all.

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Mysterious box    1951
1 hour ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Who's struggling to clear up spider camps?

You'd be surprised it's more common than you think and it's usually wolfgangs dying tho occasionally a wendy will have died to a spider and I'm feeling like this

488236936_download(18).jpeg.9a63421d2a8402457ba6d5416744f578.jpeg

That being said i feel like a lot of the hard times some players face come from pride.

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Waoling    1207

Wilson, he too generic for me, really don't understand why anyone like him, and I have a very low standard I like every character no matter what the general population says but I feel nothing toward Wilson he's just kinda bland I mean how would Wilson interact and act with people outside of the constant? I can't figure that out and I'm great at figuring out how a character would act outside their setting.

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FourthLess    288
34 minutes ago, Waoling said:

how would Wilson interact and act with people outside of the constant?

He probably wouldn't because he lives alone in the middle of the woods hiding from debts and taxes

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Lumine04    185
4 hours ago, Notecja said:

I dislike Abigail, because she is dumb and stinky (stinky ectoplasm) and kills little animals like wobsters, rabbits (carrats too?) without even being in attack mode (YES. You need to maintain Abigal, to those who think you don't have to. Or she will try kill something that is too big for her or something you don't want to kill). While Wendy's depression and dark humor are not necessary that far, Abigail used to be very cheerful person... So I don't get why she turned so evil to kill innocent rabbit just because it was on her way.

Walter is smoll, ugly, stinky and dumb. The first thing, how ineffecivevis his slingshot. Just buff it klei, don't be scared. Then his so random bee allergy, like he didn't had already gamechanging downside. The difference in his head shape between his cinematic and game - I prefer that one from cinematic.

Wes, because he is slower with collecting resources. All debuffs are fine, but that one is just boring and tendious. 

Wilson, because Devs probably will give some dumb and stinky reasons to not rework him, while he need some funny tools and toys for later in game. 

Wendy does kill passive mobs, but why dont you just unsummon her during this process it takes 2 seconds. Its good that you have to manage her, well I lied it never feels like managing since if she fights summon too big you just walk away or unsummon it aint hard. Wendys personality is perfect, no other character matches her quotes, shes the stereotypical edgy girl of the cast just like wolfgang is the classic strong but scared and wilson is the smart but no common sense. Also for Abigail is just trying to protect her sister from an unknown world, Im nice but I fight anyone who touches my best friend.

Yeah....hes pretty bad. I have to say, his an Maxwell's downsides are the most detrimental ones by a long shot compared to the other characters. Now this is fine, but he has nothing to make up for it is the problem.

Wes I dont even consider a "challenge character" he is just boring.

Wilson fit his role in singleplayer, but he needs downsides and upsides like everyone else in DST.

2 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

So, like

I'm not going to pretend that Wendy is some terribly high skill-cap character because it's just not true. But there is an art to using her most effectively. And she does trivialize some stuff, but it's mostly stuff that's... honestly pretty trivial already? Who's struggling to clear up spider camps? You can literally trap them all to death. Yes, it makes them a little easier than they should be for inexperienced players and can keep those players from improving, but I don't really believe in the "noob trap," simply because I feel like most players that won't branch out from that style of play were never going to get very far anyway.

As for Abigail's debuff, while I think the multiplier could probably stand to be tuned down a bit, taking advantage of it in the most impactful situations -- boss fights -- does in fact come as a trade-off: it forces you to either tank bosses (which can be very dangerous), or be ridiculously good at micro-managing Abigail. If you try to dodge boss attacks with Abigail out, she'll end up taking all those hits unarmored right on the chin and won't last very long at all.

There is an art, but bad example. Like I said learning to utilize her damage boost for Wendy by knowing how to keep Abigail alive for the longest time possible has got to be the craziest trial'n'error I have ever played through in this game. Though she is a noob-trap, yet your right in the fact that most people will use her to kill the basics and swap for someone else after getting bored of Abigail. For those who are new to Abigail, it typically only takes 2 tier three spider dens to take out Abigail at max power. This is only true if you do the three things I see most people who farm spider dens incorrectly with Abigail do. Random advice;

- You dont take the dens out at dusk, Abigail gets a damage boost the darker it gets. Being weaker by a sizable amount during the day.

- Not helping her with spider warriors, these bad boys are not stunlockable. The damage will add up as you take out your tier three's.

- Not saving spider glands for her, if you have a humongous spider farm like me if you dont heal Abigail she will run out of health overtime.

But yes for those Wendy mains out there. Learn how to use Abigail in boss fights wothout letting her retreat, and oh my goodness please save a pipspook once in awhile!

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Waoling    1207
19 minutes ago, FourthLess said:

He probably wouldn't because he lives alone in the middle of the woods hiding from debts and taxes

I think the wood he used to live in is now deforested or under the goverment or a private land own by some rich guy.

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Faintly Macabre    1272

I was thinking beyond the "clearly doesn't even know the basics" segment of the game's players. Obviously if you don't know anything about what you're doing, you're liable to get rekt until you do. The point was just that doing a lot of things people complain Abigail makes too easy is just not that hard in the first place with basic knowledge of the game. The only things I can think of that Abigail trivializes in ways other characters can't replicate fairly easily with some know-how is stuff like Shadow Splumonkey murder sprees and rockless Slurtle farming.

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ArubaroBeefalo    18167
1 hour ago, Lumine04 said:

Wendy does kill passive mobs, but why dont you just unsummon her during this process it takes 2 seconds

sure, takes 2 sec but you need to remember abi kills outside of kill mode which leads to loabster pens decimated by the time you remember that

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Waoling    1207

Every single player character suck (except for Wagstaff) because we won't ever know what are their backstory or who they are, and we won't ever gonna get to see them in an animated short, and also they aren't playable in DST that suck.

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Cheggf    8618
5 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

And she does trivialize some stuff, but it's mostly stuff that's... honestly pretty trivial already?

Bee queen and ancient fuelweaver are trivial?

5 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

Who's struggling to clear up spider camps?

Other than the fact that many people do struggle to clear spider camps (and hounds, frogs, bees, monkeys, etc), it would take like 8 Wolfgangs trying super hard to rival Wendy doing nothing.

Trying to clear as many spiders as Abigail can is harder than many boss fights. 

5 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

If you try to dodge boss attacks with Abigail out, she'll end up taking all those hits

Not true.

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jan Mele    1260
19 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Not true.

DFly isn't the only boss in the game

19 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Other than the fact that many people do struggle to clear spider camps (and hounds, frogs, bees, monkeys, etc), it would take like 8 Wolfgangs trying super hard to rival Wendy doing nothing.

2 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

I was thinking beyond the "clearly doesn't even know the basics" segment of the game's players. Obviously if you don't know anything about what you're doing, you're liable to get rekt until you do. The point was just that doing a lot of things people complain Abigail makes too easy is just not that hard in the first place with basic knowledge of the game.

If you don't help Abby, you won't save time.

A big exaggeration, especially with the 8 Wolfgangs thing

While Abby can kill a number of mobs by herself, she often gets to very low health in these scenarios. You can check using the console commands.

19 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Bee queen and ancient fuelweaver are trivial?

Good point.

Also, I didn't play vanilla in a while, but

Oh, about you saying that the character is uninteractive. You can unsummon Abby by hitting her, which requires either getting close or using a ranged weapon, but has a faster animation. You also have to unsummon her while catching rabbits up close, or she will kill them. Unsummoning Abby instead of soothing her will cause the mob that attacked her to loose aggro. Oh, and you can manipulate enemies into attacking the ghost instead of you, usually by making her land the last hit during the target's attack cooldown, but it's not always possible.

Definitely not saying Wendy isn't OP tho

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Lumine04    185
53 minutes ago, jan Mele said:

DFly isn't the only boss in the game

Id hope not, but I also hope you not implying Abigail is useless against bosses cause frankly that isn't true. Abigail's damage boost when vexing enemies should be learned to be taken advantage of when you main her. Bosses like deerclops, dragonfly, eye of terror, bee queen (especially BQ), and ancient guardian are just to name a few. Also people always leave out perfumes...like are people who play Wendy just never touching those or something? My point is, Abby is strong if you learn how to keep her alive in fights. 

57 minutes ago, jan Mele said:

If you don't help Abby, you won't save time.

While Abby can kill a number of mobs by herself, she often gets to very low health in these scenarios.

 

Yes this is a crucial part to Abby that I mentioned before. If you are just watching Abby do her thing, your already playing Wendy wrong. Also your point about spiders, hounds, etc is not exactly right cause perfumes, and also the fact that you can heal Abigail yourself. Something I do is carry some honey bandages for her and my buddy who plays Wortox heals me, otherwise bring some healy food for you. 

3 hours ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

sure, takes 2 sec but you need to remember abi kills outside of kill mode which leads to loabster pens decimated by the time you remember that

,,,seems like a personal issue. Playing with Wendy for awhile, you should at least know when to put Abby up for a second as her attacking passive mobs requires you to be near the mob if she is soothed too. I'm not seeing your point here as like I said I doubt one could be forgetful enough for that to happen repeatedly enough.

As always I enjoy da' opinions!

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Mike23Ua    14497

Actually my BIGGEST problem with these characters isn’t any of the characters themselves, but rather how different they play on PC compared to using an Xbox Controller-

Anyone who claims Wortox isn’t overall BETTER on PC has clearly lost their mind..

Needing to be very close to Abigail to Unsummon her from a fight she’s already in-

These things make a MASSIVE Difference and what is broken and seems overpowered on PC could very well be barely playable at all when you use a Controller.

After having watched several Twitch streams I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that the new Craft UI was made as a ease of convince and use for PC KB+Mouse- you just click something to the left of your screen and drag and drop it where you want to place it, MEANWHILE the Old original UI was better and more convenient with the Xbox Controller.

If Klei ever wants to take crossplay seriously the differences between playing with a Mouse & Playing on Console need to be addressed…

Did you know the little Emoteicons don’t work at all on console? Nope, never have and therefore there’s this whole entire section of the game where I don’t own or use a single cosmetic from because when I DID own a few: they didn’t work.

I bet there’s a whole bunch of other features I’m incapable of performing on Controller as opposed to using a Mouse, for example I did not know you could DODGE a hostile pig enemy’s attack as Wurt and give them a clever disguise so they stop hitting you- I did not know this.. because dragging and dropping a mask onto a pig is impossible with an Xbox controller, instead.. you need to be the same distance as Unsummoning Abigail is with a controller to do this.. and by that time your punched in the face again.

Personally I wish Klei would have hired a Console development team who would’ve dedicated their entire job to making the QoL of gameplay for Console players better: Like a professional set of people who can adapt the game to Xbox/PlayStation/Switch controllers to the best of their capabilities- Because I’m just going to be brutally honest: Had I known that DS/DST was a PC game first and foremost and ported to Consoles as an Afterthought- I probably would’ve never gotten into this franchise at all.

I can say one thing with absolute certainty though: if PC players had a nerf targeted exclusively at them that made having to summon/Unsummon Abigail be just as close as you have to be with an Xbox controller- Then those PC players will suddenly have a new found respect and sense of Danger while playing as Wendy.

Any time I need to Unsummon Abigail on Xbox… That immediately puts ME within hitting range of whatever I needed to recall Abigail away from- and that: Can make all the difference in the world.

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Eughstein    1997

Personally i dislike like really big amount of characters in dst, like, i don't really hate most of them and ok when people play as them, but when i start a word or join one i don't even count them as option to play as
Wilson-guess yourself
Willow-even after rework still not very different from wilson in my eyes
Wendy-she is so overhyped i honestly start to feel bad when just see her, also not really a fun of a character who is based entierly around other character
Wickerbottom and Maxwell-outdated, but i want to give them a chance after their reworks
Woodie-would be a good character for me if he wasn't suffering every night in event that is needed to access my favourite boss in the game
Wes-too op
Webber-for me he is just worse wurt
Wortox and Weenowna-cool ideas but Wortox need at least 1 more mechanic and Winona should have something that won't me count her only as switch character
Walter-not really a fan of just standing on a distance and then spamming with ranged weapon

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ArubaroBeefalo    18167
53 minutes ago, Lumine04 said:

,,,seems like a personal issue. Playing with Wendy for awhile, you should at least know when to put Abby up for a second as her attacking passive mobs requires you to be near the mob if she is soothed too. I'm not seeing your point here as like I said I doubt one could be forgetful enough for that to happen repeatedly enough.

there arent any gameplay component to keep it in that way, is simply dump and maybe a bug since she doesnt damage other mobs while calm

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Faintly Macabre    1272
3 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Bee queen and ancient fuelweaver are trivial?

9 hours ago, Faintly Macabre said:

mostly

 

3 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Trying to clear as many spiders as Abigail can is harder than many boss fights.

I'll give you that it's a bit slower, but a football helmet, a bramble husk (which are super cheap now), and a good weapon will chew through 4-5 dens' worth of spiders pretty swiftly and decently safely.

3 hours ago, Cheggf said:

Not true.

Is 1/4 of Abby's health bar disappearing when I dodge 3/4 of the game's bosses' attacks just my imagination or what?

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Notecja    3005
3 hours ago, Lumine04 said:

,,,seems like a personal issue. Playing with Wendy for awhile, you should at least know when to put Abby up for a second as her attacking passive mobs requires you to be near the mob if she is soothed too. I'm not seeing your point here as like I said I doubt one could be forgetful enough for that to happen repeatedly enough.

A bit, but sometimes I don't want to summon-unsummon-summon-unsummon when I get to the base, because there is a 4-5 decorative pens with different mobs, including farm ones like grass gecko. Sometimes looks like "back to base, then in base run some wild skittersquid and require action because attacks lureplants, then again just base, then random Warlus/blue Hound, again back to base, etc." I played a lot of Wendy and sometimes happens too much in game to remember which passive mobs are going to be attacked just on the way, especially if you move a lot around. Not sure how you don't see a problem with her AI. Like somethings can attack me, but she decided to try attacking first some passive mob with "prey" tag.

4 hours ago, jan Mele said:

ou can unsummon Abby by hitting her, which requires either getting close or using a ranged weapon, but has a faster animation.

You can unsummon her with hovering flower over her. No need to hurt her :C

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Faintly Macabre    1272
18 minutes ago, Notecja said:

I played a lot of Wendy and sometimes happens too much in game to remember which passive mobs are going to be attacked just on the way

The only mobs she'll attack on passive mode are ones tagged prey, which is a very short list, and monsters, and she generally won't actually pursue prey so much as just kind of murder them if they're close enough. I can honestly say I've never once had her chase after something and leave me to die to a monster or something.

If you're talking about aggressive mode, just... don't leave her on aggressive mode.

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Lumine04    185
19 hours ago, Notecja said:

A bit, but sometimes I don't want to summon-unsummon-summon-unsummon when I get to the base, because there is a 4-5 decorative pens with different mobs, including farm ones like grass gecko. Sometimes looks like "back to base, then in base run some wild skittersquid and require action because attacks lureplants, then again just base, then random Warlus/blue Hound, again back to base, etc." I played a lot of Wendy and sometimes happens too much in game to remember which passive mobs are going to be attacked just on the way, especially if you move a lot around. Not sure how you don't see a problem with her AI. Like somethings can attack me, but she decided to try attacking first some passive mob with "prey" tag.

Sorry but I have years into Wendy and never has she randomly attacked catcoons and grass geckos. I should know as I always make morsel and grass farms for these two. On top of that all you have to do is walk away a couple steps and she'll stop attacking while in sooth. I think you may be keeping her on rile up often, which is not a good idea. Even when fighting spiders and hounds I still keep her on soothed just in case some pigs that I dont want to quarrel with come out of nowhere. 

I disagree with you saying theres issues with her AI, sounds like you got a bad copy of DST (joke...laugh...) or like I said you got her on rile up for a bit too long. I can honestly say I've never once had her chase after something and leave me to die to a monster or something. Wendy is in a good place, and unless they add more perfumes and unique structures she is in a perfect spot no tweaking needed.

  

Edited by Lumine04
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Notecja    3005
1 hour ago, Lumine04 said:

I think you may be keeping her on rile up often, which is not a good idea

Nah, I don't keep on her rile. I said, she does in peaceful mode annoying things, and I an certain about it, imo would be simply great, it that was fixed, intead of impling is all my fault : ) (Also used to have slow reaction due to internet connection).

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Lumine04    185
Just now, Notecja said:

Nah, I don't keep on her rile. I said, she does in peaceful mode annoying things, and I an certain about it, imo would be simply great, it that was fixed, intead of impling is all my fault : ) (Also used to have slow reaction due to internet connection).

My bad, didnt mean to blame you your good. Don't know how to help though, only solution is to unsummon sorry bro.

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