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Electroely    4799

I really like mutated plants, but my main problem with them always ends up being getting the seeds. That is, for most plants.

I don't have this issue with Sleet Wheat. Even with its much higher radiation resistance, getting 18 seeds from a single harvest offsets both the long life cycle and the low chance of getting a mutation because I can change most, if not all my Sleet Wheat plants to mutants right after.

With most other plants, though, it's only one seed per harvest, and that's only if the chance to drop a seed rolls (i.e. if a good farmer harvests it). Over time, it's not too hard to accumulate mutant seeds, especially of the less rad-resistant plants, but even then it takes painfully long for me to have a farm of them just because there's only a 1/10 chance of getting the mutation I want, and I have to get it many times if I want to fill my farm with said mutation.

It doesn't help that mutants themselves don't drop seeds - if they DID drop seeds, I wouldn't really have as hard of a time because I could just change out my regular plants with the various mutations I get and keep waiting for the right mutations. But as it stands, the more mutants I use, the less seeds I get. If my end-game goal is a full farm of exuberant or super-specialized grubfruits or bristle blossoms, I have to keep using non-mutants until I amass enough seeds, and that can take multiple hundred cycles especially with the lack of radiation sources - wheezeworts are limited in numbers, take up space and mess with the farm temperature. Shine bugs cause a lot of lag, the research reactor produces too much heat to not be properly insulated and nuclear waste has to have very high mass to make a difference.

The game is already playable without ever using mutant plants, but I would really like it if they were more accessible so it's easier to integrate them into regular gameplay because I think they're one of the coolest parts of the DLC so far.

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kezat    19

I really like the idea behind the mutations though my main issue with them at the moment is the on going radiation requirements even after a mutation. Perhaps if the radiation requirement was only to get mutated plants to increase the chance for the same seed from the mutated plant.

Or maybe once the radiation system is finished we will have less extreme options then to have a huge mass of shine bugs. I have not tested the reactor much but it does seem like more work then just adding a couple more unmutated plants or have the dups harvest them. 

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Coolthulhu    1214

Too rare and too hard to use as well.

At the moment, the only feasible ways of actually using mutant plants are worts and lag-causing bugs (shine and beeta). Worts are limited enough that a big farm is out of question.

Why would anyone ever plant the +decor mutant? Some mutants should just not require radiation or maybe just 1 or so of it. Like the decor mutant, which is a gimmick.

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sakura_sk    1239

I see rad lamps in our future :rolleyes: ... to lessen the burden of 25rad per mutant seed. 

As for a solution to produce more mutants of a specific mutation quicker, I think a trigger to make mutant plants produce seeds would help. The trigger could be a specific fertilizing element (uranium, depleted uranium, nuclear waste) or a specific farm tile that would allow mutant plants to produce seeds (mixed original seeds and some seeds of their mutation perhaps?) or... specific triggers per mutation and not just chance?

But yes, the 1 out of 10 in a 80% chance of the 10% drop seed chance doesn't really help (it is 80% and not 33% though so... yay! :D )

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pether    1006

I must say, I like how mutated plants are rare, not something easy you can obtain within 10 cycles. It feels much more rewarding when you collect your mutant. I fear not to rebalance this part of the DLC to make mutants appear in dozens, because then they will lose their value - you will get all you need in a few cycles and then they would become boring garbage the same way as usual ones...

On the other hand - I agree that it would be nice to allow late game solutions to get all plants you need to make your eng-game greenhause without waiting 1000 cycles...

I believe the mutants should be rare, but once you get one it should be easy to replicate them - either by collecting the same seeds from mutated plants or by some bio-engineering machines that would be able to duplicate known DNA of unlocked mutants. This way collecting mutant seed would still be "yay, finally!" moment, but after that things would go easier for the specific mutant. You wouldn't be blocked much if you mage huge bases and need mutated plants to support 500 dupes.

And yes, radiation lamps are a must! It is quite messy to deal with shinebugs and wheezeworts are in very limited numbers. Radiation lamps would be also great addition to desinfection methods as an alternative to chlorine.

So, I suggest this tldr:

  • rare mutations, chances maybe even lower than today
  • mutants drop mutated seeds of their kind
  • machine to fabricate known mutated seeds
  • radiation lamps
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Electroely    4799

I do agree that there's issues with the ambient radiation requirement... I just wanted to focus more on actually obtaining the seeds in the first place because I've found it to be way too much of a roadblock compared to actually growing them.

3 hours ago, pether said:

I must say, I like how mutated plants are rare, not something easy you can obtain within 10 cycles. It feels much more rewarding when you collect your mutant. I fear not to rebalance this part of the DLC to make mutants appear in dozens, because then they will lose their value - you will get all you need in a few cycles and then they would become boring garbage the same way as usual ones...

On the other hand - I agree that it would be nice to allow late game solutions to get all plants you need to make your eng-game greenhause without waiting 1000 cycles...

I don't want to suggest to make mutants common as dirt - like I said earlier, I'm fine with Sleet Wheat because even though its mutation chance is lower, getting the mutation once allows me to plant 18 of it. The ability to fabricate known mutations seems like a good idea in that regard.

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Sasza22    3500

Without a small portable rad source it`s super hard to get the mutants going. Usually your goal should be to replace regular plants with improved mutanted versions. With a proper rad source we would be able to make an experimental farm to stack up on seeds (still feels pretty inefficient) and a proper farm with a bit less radiation to sustain the mutated seeds.

Obviously a rad lamp would be the best but maybe we could get a plant producing radiation that we could plant alongside the mutants to passively sustain them. Curently the forest biome doesn`t have it`s own decorative plant, uses the mirth leaf native to the caustic jungle biome. Given that 2 out of 4 dlc map starts put this biome on the irradiated asteroid it could get a decorative plant that produces radiation that would take the place of the wheezewort (which seems to have too many uses with both cooling and poducing radiation).

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Rotintin    155

This is a really good thread, hopefully the dev team incorporates the ideas mentioned here as mutation definitely needs some work. Right now, it's just one of those last things you do before finishing a colony- it doesn't scale well with your colony. To fix this, I think some key ideas brought up here need to be implemented. 

The first change should be to let mutated crops drop seeds. This way you won't wait hundreds of cycles to optimally replace every plant. They could even have the same drop rates as normal plants. 

Alternatively, we could craft seeds once we discover them. This should have a very high cost to operate.

Second point is radiation generation. We need two new radiation generators:

  • A fixed cost / low output lamp (which I think is coming). For farmhouses not dependent on wheezeworts and bugs.
  • A high cost / high output machine that consumes refined uranium. Not the reactor, that's for power and requires way too much infrastructure for most players to use for farming. This would only be for generating high levels of radiation.

 

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blueberry pi    49
11 hours ago, Rotintin said:

A high cost / high output machine that consumes refined uranium. Not the reactor, that's for power and requires way too much infrastructure for most players to use for farming. This would only be for generating high levels of radiation.

what about an RTG, a radioactive thermoelectric generator, it would generate lots of radiation by using uranium, maybe a bit of power since these in real life are used to generate power but if there is a leak they can emit radiation.

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