mirrormind

My item balance wishlist after 1000 hours of playing

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Xenologist    1,429
11 minutes ago, LadyD said:

Friendly reminder everyone- Debate is fine but keep it polite and on topic. Lets all be friendly and nice 

Don't wanna summon the Joe

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00petar00    137

My take on all the items you talked about. Im kind of drunk so after i finished writing i noticed how long it is.

 

Blow Darts - A really good suggestion about getting 3 for each time you craft them, i wouldn't really care if there are no other  changes, as long as we get 3 for the current cost, it would be useful and there'd be potential to use them.

Breezy Vest - Obsolete item like most other heating equipment, they are pretty much all a joke considering how strong thermal stone is in DST compared to DS, You can survive on thermal stone and torch, burn one tree when you need to heat up and you're set. I've had games when i started in winter and had no issues surviving alone, even in the middle of winter. Usually you get beefalo hat to go with this and you'll have more time on your hands to do other stuff, basically winter is like autumn with beefalo hat and thermal stone.

Rabbit Earmuffs - are in a weird spot, i am not sure how they could be adjusted, making rabbits not run away from you, would be too strong i think, as  all you'd need is a spear and endless morsel is there for you.

Tam O' Shanter - is it really too strong? the idea is to stay insane so that you can farm nightmare fuel, it is pretty much only useful in winter and spring of the first year for me, after that i have my sanity station with evil flowers and bee queen's crown, meaning my sanity is anything i want it to be.

Tentacle Spike - is subpar weapon, has low durability and i only use it because i play wickerbottom and even then i craft ham bat pretty often as it has no durability and when i decide to fight endlessly its much more efficient.It has a good amount of damage over spear so it is useful in the early days.

It is easy to kite when you have really low ping but any higher ping then normal and you'll basically have no use for tentacle spikes as you won't be a ble to kill them fast enough to warrant obtaining the spike if you aren't able to kite it efficiently.

I am a Wickerbottom main so i'd agree with tentacles respawning, that would really be too strong though if you have Wickerbottom on your server, just bring bearger there every time he spawns and you'll have so many tantacle spots.

 

Ham Bat - i'd agree with a small damage nerf but not anything over the top, it can be said to be easy to craft but often you'd prefer using the meat for cooking so it is quite annoying. The problem here is the durability, often it is used when you want to fight without stopping for a day while if you used any other weapon, you'd need multiple of them and that could be expensive.

Bat Bat - this item basically doesn't exist in my brain, i have thousands of hours on DS and i've never crafted it in my life, even when i found it in game randomly, i'd just stash it in chest and forget about it, im thinking of leaving it the next time i see it in ruins. This item really needs a big buff.

Tail o' Three Cats - Nothing much to say here, any change to buff it would be good as it is another obsolete item, your ideas are good.

Cat Cap - I disagree about it providing more insulation then winter hat as it gives sanity. Also considering how many cat tails i have, i wouldn't want this becoming stronger. This can usually replace Tam O' Shanter if you only have one MacTusk location in your world or have been unlucky with obtaining it.

I usually kill Catcoons when i farm meat as there's possibility to get the backpack from Krampus, i've been somewhat lucky getting the best backpack before first winter a couple of times, without even needing to kill klaus.

Rain Hat - just needs lower crafting  cost.

Moggles - I'll have to disagree with you here, these last quite long, i usually carry 2 when i go to caves and i only use them in ruins or when i am fighting ancient guardian,but they are quite strong, you shouldn't have access to something that will allow you to see full screen in caves for cheap anyway. Otherwise you use Lantern as it is practically free to fuel, you have endless source of light bulbs, its one of my first go to items when i start the game, so cheap to craft and use even when you are not in caves.

Night Armor - It is in a pretty good spot, it shouldn't be buffed as it has 95% damage reduction and 750 durability, i don't really see why they should increase it. Drains a lot of sanity but there should be a penalty when using such a good item and often when you are using it you have endless supply of food items that restore sanity.

Thulecite Crown - in a really good spot, if you are going to use thulecite armor item, this is it, much better then suit.

Thulecite Suit - should be made stronger as there's currently no reason to use it over the crown because force field is just that strong and sanity isn't really that appealing late in the game when you compare it to the force field you get when you use crown.

Thulecite Pick/Axe should have a much higher durability or i'd be fine if klei removed it from the game, its just a trap for players who decide to craft it. Usually when you are in situation to craft it, you have endless gold, why'd you spend your thulecite on this is a wonder even though i have around 5-6 stacks of it at this point, i've never once used it on pick/axe.

This also goes in to how easily obtainable thulecite is in DST, i don't think they should make these items stronger as there is endless supply if you can keep killing dragonfly and obtain green gems, you use deconstruction staff and construction amulet and just craft and deconstruct the thulecite suit.

Scalemail - A very situational item, i don't think that it should be changed much, i'd like to see more game mechanics itroduced with fire where this item will be useful, usually there's endless supply of scales if you are farming green gems so you can have infinite thulecite but this item is still annoying to craft because it also takes 3 pig skin on top of that.

Scaled flooring - A nice idea, but people usually don't stay above when it is summer, you hide in caves so your forests don't burn down, even if this cuts down the cost of refueling flingomatic, i don't think i'll be above ground either way, unless im able to floor a piece of the world so my forests don't burn down but this would be such an undertaking.

Flooring in general - I don't ever plant stuff on the flooring it looks ugly to see on, not being able to plant stuff on some floors is something that should already be in the game.

Also having a specific grass floor that you can craft that doesn't allow random things to grow on it would be nice as i really like to build my base in grassy area but i usually don't as i hate when stuff grows on it and i don't really like much of other  flooring for my base.

Snelmet - Snurtle Shell Armor - Firstly Snelmet is basically almost as strong as thulecite crown without the effect, it must be rare but Snurtle Shell Armor is so good and actually has a decent drop rate and is worth aquiring, especially considering you can get the Smelmet while you farming shell armor.

Belt of Hunger - The problem with DS is that gathering food is a pain once you have over 1000 hours, you just want to cut the boring tasks like gathering grass/twigs/food as much as possible and focus on the fun tasks like killing bosses. I always use this item and this is something i really love to have when i play Wolfgang. Basically cuts your  hunger loss by 40%, how great is this in the early game when you don't have a big beebox area or spider farm setup.

Straw Hat - We talked about Rain hat earlier, i think they should just change that, this hat is fine as it is but there's pretty much no reason to make it, maybe some change is required.

Night Light - Not much to say here, a big buff is pretty much needed for it to be useful.

Pumpkin Lantern -  I think that it is fine as it is, considering that you build it for halloween it is just there to be cute.

Top Hat - Is fine as it is, if it provided more sanity then Tam O' Shanter it would be too strong, it is there for you to make Prestihatitator, i think it should be changed to make it more viable to make, maybe a completely different effect.

Basic Farm/Advanced Farm - Really a trap for newer players to build, a bad food source if we are going to be hones, the whole farming system needs a complete overhaul.

Morning Star - Its fine as it is to me, its a pretty niche item even though it is expensive, there's not much use to get out of making this. Either needs a complete change or just reduce crafting materials required.

Boomerang - No reason to exist, i don't think even if there is double the durability that people would craft it unless they are going to use it for birds. Still it would be weird if boomerang put people to sleep, there's no way to justify it doing that, maybe knockback effect if the target isn't a boss or anything big.

Monster Meat - It is fine as it is, what would be the point of it existing if there was no use. It also requires for you to farm and it spoils. I'd be fine if they changed some recipes to disallow usage of it but its my pretty much go to food as i make a spider farm and use lichen and its endless pierogi. Basically it is comparable to beeboxes except it requires much less effort to make.(Wickerbottom main only :D)

Ice - It is quite strong, its so easy to use in so many recipes in crockpot, i don't think that it should have such value but it is not really that good for late game, early and mid game it is too good.

Dapper Vest - Just needs some weird unique ability, i think there's enough items providing sanity or insulation, this item should keep these values the same and have an ability or be completely changed.

Feather Hat - Weird how expensive this item is yet there's such cheap alternative to using Wickerbottom's book. Should be much much cheaper.

Ice Cube and Fashion Melon - I feel like these items are there in case you need a quick fix for summer, maybe you joined late and it is much more likely for someone to give this to you, so there's value to keeping them as it is.

Backpacks - Obviously they are the meta, considering how few inventory slots you have and how long do you want to stay away from the base, caves or anything else it is much better to have backpack as you'll be able to gather much more stuff before going back, why would you use anything else.

The problem with speed decrease per item in backpack is that people may find it annoying considering how many inventory slots you have without backpack, will you be able to fight normal creatures with the kiting methods with full backpack or not? It would just make it boring having to drop the backpack for every fight and pick it back up after.

Straw Roll/Fur Roll - These feel like situational items that you can use when you are away from your base, i think they are fine as they are.

Siesta Lean-to - I think that it has its role as it can be useful in summer for regenerating sanity and just keeping yourself away from heat. How would you use a tent in summer when day lasts so long? Its understandable that most players will go to caves but some players may actually want to stay above when it is summer.

Rain-o-Meter/Thermal Measurer - They are just there and i see it more as decoration. Maybe examining them could grant you random recipe from alchemy engine that you haven't crafted yet, there could be a chance each day, really low though just something to look forward to seeing it. Like becoming smarter by understanding how it works and figuring out a recipe, could be a nice surprise.

Grass Suit - I feel like if it was 5 grass to craft, people would use it for fire and just make big grass farms instead of trees, just removing it from the game would be fine, there's really no use to it currently outside of using it as fuel if you find it randomly.

One-man Band - This could be a balancing nightmare, if it is stronger it could be a problem, currently it is quite weak.

Octuvigil - It already has many uses, showing on the map and you can basically monitor anything going on there plus allowing the crafting of maps, any more effects like showing the location to lunar island would make it too over the top.

Fire/Ice Staff - They are quite cheap so i am not sure if it would be good if they were stronger.

The Lazy Deserter - It should be usable solo with the math done on how much sanity the two players use currently and just use these numbers for one player.

Telelocator Staff/Telelocator Focus - Basically Varg farm maker, there's literally no point in using it anywhere else considering how expensive it is and i don't think it should be made cheaper as it would just make bosses much easier to kill.

Walls - There are some uses like Splumonkey/beebox farms, so that you can avoid bees in spring if they are close to your base. At least this is quite great for nightmare fuel farming.

Bee Mine - Big damage increase would be great, i'd love to find uses for something like that in the game but currently there's no point.

Napsack - considering Toadstool is pretty much pointless to kill outside of the Mushlight that is broken every winter because of the festive lights, there's no point in making this item though, much more efficient to make a mushlight.

Whirly Fan/Parasol - Another group of cheap items that players may give newer players on server, i don't think that these should be changed.

Weather Pain - It is currently great as you use it for Fuelweaver fight and also great for farming living logs because of poison birchnut trees spawn rate of 33% per tree chopped down at day 70, weather pain one use takes it down. So yeah i always run out of weather pains and they are quite a "pain" to farm.

End Table - I feel like this was supposed to be used as decoration yet people found weird ways to use it for specific setups.

Luxury Fan - I think that this item is quite weird, lowering your temperature instantly compared to any other equipment or item that is used to keep you from overheating or freezing, it would be quite weird if you can use this too much even though i never craft it as i use all the resources on weather pain.

Honey Poultice - Why are you even making this? just make Honey Nuggets? requires any morsel or monster meat and i just put 3 honey as usually by the time i start making bee farm, i have endless honey and i'd rather use that then any other resource for crockpot. Just 10 less health yet it takes 1 morsel compared to 1 papyrus, yes it does spoil but much better to craft, by this point you'll have bundle wrap from bee queen so it would be the same to you if it spoils or not, i usually craft them in packs of 20-30 and bundle, then unwrap it when i get 20-30 more and until i fill the whole bundle wrap(4 stacks), after that its just a question of what you want to fight with so much healing.

Bee Queen Crown - Pretty much the only normal use is fuelweaver fight, the weird way players often use it is sanity station, just make evil flower area where you'll have 10 sanity regen per second with the crown on, that way you can control your sanity permanently, if you want it lowered, you take the hat off.

Hibernation Vest - I think that it is fine as it is, lowering hunger loss and has the same insulation compared to puffy vest.

"Obscure" Crockpot Recipes - I feel like the only reason they are obscure is that they are not good enough, it would be hard to balance if there were so many recipes that were similar to the current strong ones, outside of making them the same, what else can be done? some items are just much easier to aquire so that is why it is so popular with the players.  It is just impossible for them to balance if you want all recipes to be used equally by all the players, for example it is much more efficient to make bee box farm then advanced farms and making melonsicle with ice/twig/melon.

That's the problem that can't be solved, there will never be a point in a game where you'll lose 80% of the items, there's no game out there that has a player use 80% of its items when they are all pretty much so similar and some are much easier to obtain yet the ones that are easier will always be put above the ones that are harder.

If for example Klei saw this thread and decided to balance items, nothing much would change, you'll still be using the same amount of items yet they'll be different to current ones. The only way for them to actually make it worthwhile is for there to be specific item effects and more niche uses for each item, if there is a specific instance you want to use an item in and it is a significant and it is done often, you'll have that item. Like how i am using Weather pain so much to farm living logs.

I don't know if you played a game like League where meta changes constantly, there's not much there except players get bored out of having to relearn everything each season. I don't want to see something similar in DS, obviously such a thing won't happen as klei hasn't done any item changes in but when they release new content there are situations where obsolete items become useful, maybe they could change obsolete items but not touch the currently strong ones, that way players won't be mad if they craft an item and realize it is weaker.

Edited by 00petar00
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Superlucas1231    1,121
On 12/22/2019 at 9:18 PM, mirrormind said:

Tam 'O' Shanter - Is too strong. It basically gives the player immunity to most forms of sanity drain yet is relatively easy to acquire and mass produce even. Plus it's only really unusable during the summer so that's three quarters of the year that players can essentially be part Maxwell.

 

On 12/22/2019 at 9:18 PM, mirrormind said:

Top Hat - Considering that it provides no other benefits than sanity it aught to provide more sanity than a tam o shanter, which does have alternate benefits beyond its sanity regeneration.

So basically nerf the tam, an item that:

  • is only available in winter
  • has a 25% to drop from a rare mob that has a 2-ish day spawn rate, 
  • can't really be use in summer unless you like overheating

And change it into a glorified winter hat. But buff the top hat, an item that:

  • can be crafted at like, day 7 (earlier if you're a Webber and do spider wars)
  • can be mass produce
  • has a 20% rain res (which can make you immune to rain w/ umbrella)
  • can be used all year with zero drawbacks
  • doesn't even force you to fight a mob to get it lmao

Because nerfing something meta to make it un-meta literally just to make another item the new meta is good game design.

On 12/22/2019 at 9:18 PM, mirrormind said:

So after a thousand hours of playing I feel like posting this regardless.

 

On 12/22/2019 at 9:18 PM, mirrormind said:

and after a thousand hours of playing I've both seen this in other servers and in my ow

 

On 12/22/2019 at 9:18 PM, mirrormind said:

again from my own experience after a thousand hours;

Sorry kid you need at least 3,000 hours to have an opinion about game balance try again when your older

 

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CameoAppearance    1,539
3 hours ago, Rellimarual said:

This is not a big deal, but people always forget that the parasol gives sanity when equipped. I don’t make them often but sometimes in a pinch that’s handy, especially if you just picked a bunch of flowers anyway. A lot of these items are not meant for routine use, but are things that can save you if, say, you die and res yourself at a touchstone with no gear. If you are the kind of player who can improvise and remembers how to whip together a little-used item that can get you back to base, that’s one of the ways to be good at the game. DS rewards players who are resourceful, creative, and knowledgeable about its own arcana. Every time I’ve come up with a non-routine method of getting out of a fix, it is about 20 times more fun than min/maxing. Some items are always going to be rarely used. That’s not to say that Tail o Three Cats or whatever shouldn’t be buffed, because it’s such an awesome looking item and it would be fun to have more occasion to use it. Still I’ll never forget the time I saw a streamer whip Deerclops to death. There is such a thing as style.  

Couldn't have put it better myself.

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Nin Ya    150

What if bunny earmuffs would not need science maschine to craft? If I join in spring, i can make parasol+strawhat (+ tree abuse for 0 wetness). If I join in summer, I can make whirlwind fan and strawhat, while chilling  under trees. Autumn is easy. But only way to survive winter without preparation is to burn stuff or keep making campfires. Not fun for anyone except Willow.   

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Owlrus98    1,022
On 12/22/2019 at 9:18 PM, mirrormind said:

Rabbit Earmuffs - Although being relatively easy to craft they are so bad there's basically no reason to even bother, they provide so little warmth that even if you're desperate they still give you little to no actual benefit. There's really not much you can do to balance them that wouldn't disrupt the status quo with the winter hat, so I would suggest giving them a different benefit entirely such as a small speed boost or causing rabbits to no longer run away from the player.

Majora's Mask called, it want's its bunny hood back

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Kynoox_    641

 

Blow Darts - It's for engages, they have high damage and for specific farms.

Breezy Vest - It's good where it is. not too much good and not too much bad. it's
meant for a very early winter. And for players who are new to the game.

Rabbit Earmuffs - As I said above. very early winter gear. And you can craft them
if you're in a very problematic situation.

Tam o' Shanter - It's probably meant to be the "best hat" for player to use most of
the time. Most of insanity auras affects the hat's sanity aura.

Tentacle Spikes - "If the player knows how to kite tentacles, or lures powerful
enemies into fighting them, the player can easily mass produce this." I'll probably
use this argument for Dragon Fruits and Ruins Gear later.

Ham Bat - Please. it's a perishable weapon. I Think the perks are ok since it will
lose damage when perishing.

Bat Bat - What? Bat Bat is a very good weapon. Bat Bat fits Maxwell and Wigfrid
Perfectly since they have Sanity Regen and the healing income from bat bat is
pretty ok. No need nerfs/buffs.

Tail o' Three Cats - This weapon has a significant range and have a chance to
stun enemies. It's not very good for combats, but maybe useful for other
purpouses.

Cat Cap - Cat caps restores 3.3/min. Winter Hat restores 1.33. you must choose:
sanity or warmth.

Rain Hat - It's meant to use alongside another wetness item. and it's super easy
to craft since moleworms and bone shards are very common. 

Moggles - "are harder to craft and much harder to fuel, generally only being
useful for exploring the ruins" No. if you played 1000 hours you should know how
to kite a Depth Worm. said that you only need 1 Glow Berry to craft Moggles. and
you can refuel it with Lesser Glow Berry.

Night Armor - Pretty ok. high defense at sanity cost. like Dark Sword: High
Damage at sanity cost. Using your argument about farming tentacle spikes:
Good players can easily farm tons of Nightmare Fuel to craft this one.

Scaled Flooring - Providing immunity to moldering will completely remove the
most common summer mechanic lol. The item is really useful where it is.

Flooring in General - Nothing to say about. the system is pretty ok no need for
realism.

Artificial Flooring - Providing speed boost on all man-made flooring is not good.
Cobblestone was made for that. I think the actual floors are good and don't need
any kind of buff.

Shelmet, Snurtle Shell Armor - Shelmet is one of the strongests armors in the
game, but they're nerfed in DST. Snurtle 10% spawn rate is totally ok. since you
can avoid completely the damge of any mob using the Shell Armor. it's a cheaper
Bone Armor i'd say.

Belt of Hunger - It's meant for exploring without coming back to get food or if
you're doing something that you can't return to base. and It's really good for
Wolfgang and Spring Wormwood.

Straw Hat - Early game hat, small Summer protection, small wetness protection.
We really need buff for this?

Night Light - The item isn't good at all but, you can use it to get insane. also it
provides a decent amount of light. 

Pumpkin Lantern - Decorative item?

Top Hat - Very good sanity sustain early game, ingredient for Prestihatitator.
Works like a Tam o' Shanter for Wendy. (Small Insanity Auras)

Basic Farm and Improved Farm - Improved Farm don't need any buff/nerf. Basic
farm isn't good at all but you can craft it for early game fillers.

Morning Star - Goat horns isn't that hard to farm. Considering you need a Warly
to craft the food, Morning Star is good when you don't have warly. Good to farm
Electric Milk and kill mobs that are Wet.

Boomerang - Engage for Malbatross and other mobs like Koalefant. has 10 uses =
10 Koalefants. cheap craft.

Monster Meat - "Should automatically turn any meal it's cooked with into monster
lasagna. If birds are fed it they should produce a bad egg" Ehh, no. MM was
meant to be a meat filler in Crock Pot recipes, most of the mobs drops this so it's
basically a common food.

Ice - As I said above ice is a common filler, why do you bother to talk about this
one? 

Dapper Vest - Was meant to craft the Hibernation Vest. and since it gives you
3.33 Sanity/min you can negate sanity drain from Rain.

Feather Hat - When Feather Hat is equipped, 5-7 Birds will land with a 2-10
second delay + Boomerang it's a decent morsel farm.

Ice Cube - Not really useful, but it lasts forever inside the icebox. 

Fashin Melon - It's fashion, needs to be like that.

Backpacks - Everything you said about this: No.

Straw Roll and Fur Roll - Meant for players who like to restore their status on the
run. Fur Roll is actually good for Ruins Rush If you ask me.

Siesta Lean-to - Siesta is really good after long night fights and for summer due
to long day.

Rain-o-Meter and Thermal Measures - Just no. They're not meant to be like that.
Also the Rain-o-Meter is really useful for players who don't use mods or play SW.

Grass Suit - Grass suit isn't good for combat, but it's good for picking cactus or
to fuel machines and firepits.

One-mand Band - Nothing to say about.

Ocuvigil - What? Ocuvigil is meant to show newcomers where is the base or other
things, as well to mark specific locations like: Bee Queen, Toadstool and Loot
Stash.

Fire / Ice Staff - Ice Staff is really useful to chesse some mobs and engage them.
Fire Staff isn't good for combat but useful in specific situations.

The Lazy Deserter - This structure was meant for Multiplayer worlds, sorry if you
play Don't Starve Together solo.

Walls - Useless? I don't think so, you can use walls to cheese Dragonfly, make
decorations, farms etc.

Bee Mine - Nothing to say about.

Napsack - Long live Shroom Skin duplication!

Whirly Fan - Extremely useful when joining at summer this item can really save
you.

Pretty Parasol - Same as above.

End Table - Decoration and farming purposes.

Luxury Fan - Really good if you don't have a Thermal Stone, since it completely
lowers your temperature. And can puts out nearby Fires.

Honey Poultice - I Think 25 healing it's pretty good for the crafting cost. since you
can mass farm this.

Bee Queen Crown - I mean it's really useful in Ruins since you can restore your
sanity staying near Nightmare Light and completely reverse Insanity Auras.

Hibernation Vest - It's the best Winter gear for body slot. also it reduces your
hunger by 25% and restores 4.4 sanity.

All of the obscure Crock Pot recipes - Go ahead and stop making Meatballs, try
something new! Surf 'N' Turf, Pumpkin Cookies, Trail Mix are good examples.

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metallichydra    2,346

obviously, if you cant find a use for all the stuff in the game, you are a bad player

On 23/12/2019 at 3:18 AM, mirrormind said:

players can essentially be part Maxwell

but then you will not be able to wear any hats or head armor

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Shosuko    940
10 hours ago, Kynoox_ said:

A whole bunch of just saying NO to everything...

Why post at all if you're just going to hand-wave everything away as "its alright"

Like sure - I can learn to play the game.  I'm pretty sure I have learned how to play it...  That doesn't mean there are things I feel could use a tune up.  If you actually have a counter point please post it, but 2 pages of just "nope" is kinda a waste...

Quote

Rabbit Earmuffs - As I said above. very early winter gear. And you can craft them
if you're in a very problematic situation.

Rabbit Earmuffs require an science machine to craft.  This makes them kinda bad as an improvisational item as you'll have to have prototyped them before.  This is the same science requirement as beefalo hat which is far superior.  Rabbits also take a bit of resources to catch.  I never "accidentally" have rabbits in my inventory lol

I think Rabbit Earmuffs is a great candidate for a re-work.

It might be cool if they were a perishable headgear similar to fashion melons.  Give them a sanity reduction but also a heating effect of 5 degrees.  In this way they are useful if you do need to improvise as they can keep you warm without a thermal stone for a little bit while you're exploring.

Quote

Scaled Flooring - Providing immunity to smoldering will completely remove the
most common summer mechanic lol. The item is really useful where it is.

Smolder is probably the most anti-fun mechanic in this game.  You can either add the continual chore of refueling flingos scaled by the size of your base... or just base in oasis or in caves.  There is no "playing around" smolder, people play to eliminate it.  If these floors gave you a way to smolderproof your base we'd instantly have way more flexibility in base location and design.  I like having more options a lot more than having less options.

If you're worried about flingos being rendered irrelevant we'll still need them for fire hounds and other farms.  Don't worry about flingos, they can still be in the game.

Quote

Night Light - The item isn't good at all but, you can use it to get insane. also it
provides a decent amount of light. 

And yet... we can still suggest improvements!  This is the problem.  You only say things are "okay the way they are," you don't give any reason we would -want- them the way they are.  Only handwaving away suggestions without any genuine comment.

Right now only Willow has an excuse to craft these...  And its a pretty weak excuse.  Are they a fashion item for 1 character?  No.  So why not suggest a way to change them?

Quote

Basic Farm and Improved Farm - Improved Farm don't need any buff/nerf. Basic
farm isn't good at all but you can craft it for early game fillers.

If anything in this game could use a complete re-work, its farming.  They are not okay in any measure.  They are way too expensive for providing mostly fillers.  The rate of getting plant specific seeds from feeding a bird makes mass producing a specific crop a long term chore... which is funny because in the long term no crop is actually useful compared to other options.  We got stone fruit trees, probably the most OP food source in the game, and you're gonna say farms are alright? lol

Just look at the farm centric characters:
Wormwood - forced to use farming only - in trade, removed the requirement to actually craft farms.
Warly - needs access to a variety of food stuffs to vary his diet - in trade gets super buff seasonings.
Wurt - needs to eat only vegetables - in trade gets a multiplier to how much hunger she gains from plants because farms are bad.

Quote

Morning Star - Goat horns isn't that hard to farm. Considering you need a Warly
to craft the food, Morning Star is good when you don't have warly. Good to farm
Electric Milk and kill mobs that are Wet.

Goat horn is actually a pretty tedious thing to grind out...  and you're going to want a lot of weather pains...  However I can't really speak for the usefulness of morningstar.  I haven't tried playing with them.  They could be great if you can easily wet other mobs, otherwise eh...

Quote

The Lazy Deserter - This structure was meant for Multiplayer worlds, sorry if you
play Don't Starve Together solo.

Am I a second class citizen because I play solo?  Again you're not even arguing or debating, you're just hand-waving.  YOU may be okay with something, but that doesn't mean something is okay.

 

Edited by Shosuko
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Mike23Ua    3,014

Some of us bought this game to play Multiplayer with friends and family.

We DID NOT Buy it expecting it to become a 6-8 player RPG where I would even “need” teammates to find a use for certain items.

I’ve never crafted or used a Lazy Deserter but if it’s an item that requires multiple people to operate then I do not ever foresee myself making it.

I play this game ALONE for the most part when I want to play it seriously- The Multiplayer Component is just so me and my family can play together.

Having said that... I Do wish like all hell that Klei would take a page out of Gearbox Studios books with their Blockbuster hit Franchise BORDERLANDS- What Borderlands did right was it was a drop in- drop out coop game, but the difference between BORDERLANDS and DONT STARVE TOGETHER is that any time a player joined or left a world the worlds content scaled to a difficulty to match the amount of players playing..

(In DST’s case.. this would auto scale hound wave attacks down from having 15 of them chasing you to about 5 at the most.. it would also effect bosses intended for multiple players health bars and damage being scaled down to make up for lack of players playing.)

 

I have pretty much come to terms with the fact that the ONLY way I will ever kill a Dragonfly Solo for the Achievement.. is if I Kite multiple seasons of Bearger into her biome & force them to attack each other repeatedly. But ... it doesn’t have to be this way- If Klei would just add in some sort of Borderlands style Multiplayer content scaling system.

Edited by Mike23Ua

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Sweaper    379
16 hours ago, Shosuko said:

Rabbit Earmuffs require an science machine to craft.  This makes them kinda bad as an improvisational item as you'll have to have prototyped them before.  This is the same science requirement as beefalo hat which is far superior.  Rabbits also take a bit of resources to catch.  I never "accidentally" have rabbits in my inventory lol

Most worlds (if not all unless heavily modified) have rabbits and the mosaic biome near spawn, that won't happen as often with beefalos and they could be extinct too by winter already. So if you can't get to 5 golds from the mosaic might as well craft a science machine (if you didn't find one, but on most publics I can find one already built in mosaic or near spawn) and a trap and use 2 minutes of the daytime to catch the rabbits that will let you cover more ground instead of wasting 50% of your playtime time looking at a fire since it takes around 1 minute and 10 seconds to go from overheating to freezing without any gears and the same time to get back to overheat with tree burning. With an earmuffs you'll get roughly 3 minutes and 20 seconds.

 

Tldr: The difference of time isn't big, but if you have the material for a trap, is near rabbits which they often spawn near portal and found a gold or science machine you are better off crafting it to save time looking at fire.

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CameoAppearance    1,539
21 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

I have pretty much come to terms with the fact that the ONLY way I will ever kill a Dragonfly Solo for the Achievement.. is if I Kite multiple seasons of Bearger into her biome & force them to attack each other repeatedly. But ... it doesn’t have to be this way- If Klei would just add in some sort of Borderlands style Multiplayer content scaling system.

Use a sleep item (panflute, ideally) and a stack of like 15 gunpowder. That's how the Willow player from my group does it.

As for the Lazy Deserter: With Return of Them it now has a use in solo worlds, because you can build it on the lunar island and use it to rapidly lower your lunacy.

Aside from that... I know a lot of people like running solo servers and I wouldn't want Klei to ruin that experience by adding some mandatory mechanic that requires multiple players to interact with it at the same time, but DST exists in order to be the multiplayer version of Don't Starve. I don't think it's unfair for it to have optional items that are only useful when playing with someone else, or for the game to have a static balance calibrated for 3-6 people rather than Klei making it a priority to give a solo player, a duo, and a group of 6 equal odds of taking down any individual enemy. I know it's a separate purchase and it doesn't have all the same content but if you're routinely frustrated by DST not being designed with a singleplayer experience in mind and you can afford things like DLC characters or skin sets for it, you should probably at least try singleplayer Don't Starve.

For that matter, if you've never played the standalone singleplayer version of Don't Starve you might be overestimating how much of the difficulty of DST comes from being balanced for multiplayer anyway. The maximum number of hounds per wave in singleplayer is 10, not "about 5". I was playing in a singleplayer RoG world just this afternoon and I got chased by probably 7 hounds in each hound attack, and I haven't even reached day 100 on that save yet. Even if you don't want to buy another separate Don't Starve game to find out firsthand you can at least look up how things work in the singleplayer-only version -- and therefore what Klei considers to be a fair challenge for one player -- by checking the wiki.

Edited by CameoAppearance
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Mike23Ua    3,014
37 minutes ago, CameoAppearance said:

Use a sleep item (panflute, ideally) and a stack of like 15 gunpowder. That's how the Willow player from my group does it.

As for the Lazy Deserter: With Return of Them it now has a use in solo worlds, because you can build it on the lunar island and use it to rapidly lower your lunacy.

Aside from that... I know a lot of people like running solo servers and I wouldn't want Klei to ruin that experience by adding some mandatory mechanic that requires multiple players to interact with it at the same time, but DST exists in order to be the multiplayer version of Don't Starve. I don't think it's unfair for it to have optional items that are only useful when playing with someone else, or for the game to have a static balance calibrated for 3-6 people rather than Klei making it a priority to give a solo player, a duo, and a group of 6 equal odds of taking down any individual enemy. I know it's a separate purchase and it doesn't have all the same content but if you're routinely frustrated by DST not being designed with a singleplayer experience in mind and you can afford things like DLC characters or skin sets for it, you should probably at least try singleplayer Don't Starve.

For that matter, if you've never played the standalone singleplayer version of Don't Starve you might be overestimating how much of the difficulty of DST comes from being balanced for multiplayer anyway. The maximum number of hounds per wave in singleplayer is 10, not "about 5". I was playing in a singleplayer RoG world just this afternoon and I got chased by probably 7 hounds in each hound attack, and I haven't even reached day 100 on that save yet. Even if you don't want to buy another separate Don't Starve game to find out firsthand you can at least look up how things work in the singleplayer-only version -- and therefore what Klei considers to be a fair challenge for one player -- by checking the wiki.

I already own every version of Don’t Starve acrossed multiple devices, I own Single player DS and DS Shipwrecked for both Xbox and Mobile (Which by the way Yes DS and DS Shipwrecked are also available for Mobile smartphones for anyone who didn’t already know that.) I do not own DS Hamlet- it hasn’t been released on Xbox yet.

why do you think that I’ve been asking for an Adventures Mode for DST? lol  but I mostly can’t go back and spend a ton of time into single player DS because of how customizable clothing and item skins have spoiled me.

I missed out on ALOT of DST Limited time Skin drops such as the Wintersfeast Lantern because I was spending all my time in Solo DS Shipwrecked or trying to conquer Adventure Mode in the Base game.

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kiwikenobi    881
1 hour ago, CameoAppearance said:

As for the Lazy Deserter: With Return of Them it now has a use in solo worlds, because you can build it on the lunar island and use it to rapidly lower your lunacy.

Wow, that's really clever!

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Shosuko    940
1 hour ago, CameoAppearance said:

As for the Lazy Deserter: With Return of Them it now has a use in solo worlds, because you can build it on the lunar island and use it to rapidly lower your lunacy.

Lunacy isn't really a problem though, the island is pretty safe even max lunacy.  And I don't really see the need to return to the island after stealing all the stone fruits...  which can be done pretty easily before the first summer...

Quote

Aside from that... I know a lot of people like running solo servers and I wouldn't want Klei to ruin that experience by adding some mandatory mechanic that requires multiple players to interact with it at the same time, but DST exists in order to be the multiplayer version of Don't Starve. I don't think it's unfair for it to have optional items that are only useful when playing with someone else, or for the game to have a static balance calibrated for 3-6 people rather than Klei making it a priority to give a solo player, a duo, and a group of 6 equal odds of taking down any individual enemy. I know it's a separate purchase and it doesn't have all the same content but if you're routinely frustrated by DST not being designed with a singleplayer experience in mind and you can afford things like DLC characters or skin sets for it, you should probably at least try singleplayer Don't Starve.

I'm not concerned about "equal odds," but when they changed the wall / bee pathing so you couldn't place a wall next to the water edge to help separate the bee queen from her grumbles that put a BIG damper on solo play.  The fight already took 2-3 days and about 40 perogies and 7-8 bee hats, now it also takes measuring out the distance of her tether and 3-4 days to do the fight...  Thats a lot of punishment that only solo players feel.  Also the AntLion is a boss you are forced to deal with, and only provides a bonus to multiplayer groups.  You either get really annoying sinkholes, cave ins (kinda nice sometimes), or fight him.  If he was optional I don't think I'd mind as much, but I'm forced to deal with a boss that literally gives me nothing.

Quote

For that matter, if you've never played the standalone singleplayer version of Don't Starve you might be overestimating how much of the difficulty of DST comes from being balanced for multiplayer anyway. The maximum number of hounds per wave in singleplayer is 10, not "about 5". I was playing in a singleplayer RoG world just this afternoon and I got chased by probably 7 hounds in each hound attack, and I haven't even reached day 100 on that save yet. Even if you don't want to buy another separate Don't Starve game to find out firsthand you can at least look up how things work in the singleplayer-only version -- and therefore what Klei considers to be a fair challenge for one player -- by checking the wiki.

I would say most of the day to day challenges are easier in DST because attacks aren't instant on some mobs like bees, and we have more stuff we can do (lunar island, celestial portal.)  However the stacked health means fights take longer.  That means a lot more risk of running into a hound wave while fighting a boss, because you're fighting that boss for 2-3 days.  Meanwhile a group of 4-6 literally just crafted ham bats and held f for a quick kill...

Also telltale hearts give groups SUPER easy resurrections, but because you can't haunt it you have to get magic and red gems to built life giving amulets and meat effigies, or get lucky digging graves.  Why aren't the hearts able to be used solo?  This especially sucks because I have no reason to craft them, yet I have multiple skins for them...

Sure would be nice if they thought "gee, maybe we shouldn't penalize people for playing solo..."  DST isn't just the multiplayer version of DS, all of the new content is released for it, it has tons of skins, and on the splash page they even admit this is a sequel of sorts.  DST is basically DS2.  There isn't much reason to go back to DS from here.

51 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

I missed out on ALOT of DST Limited time Skin drops such as the Wintersfeast Lantern because I was spending all my time in Solo DS Shipwrecked or trying to conquer Adventure Mode in the Base game.

Yeah, DST is definitely the place to play.

Edited by Shosuko
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Shosuko    940
11 hours ago, Sunset Skye said:

I've never been a fan of this attitude. I have literally heard it regularly for years, since before ANR, when we just had beefalo riding and disease and thought "Through the Ages" was a thing that was coming.
When it was Beefalo riding and disease vs. early SW, DST was always called the better game that gets all the new content.
When it was ANR vs. SW, DST was always called the better game that gets all the new content.
Now it's ANR + early RoT vs. SW and Hamlet, and DST is being called the better game that gets all the new content.
Even if DS gets something new, which I really believe it will eventually, DST will continue to be called the better game that gets all the new content.
DST isn't the game where all of the new content is being released, and it isn't DS 2, it's a different game that receives different content that so far has coexisted just fine with DS.

Shipwrecked was originally going to be a completely different game, not a DS expansion.  It was only after the feedback of fans that Klei changed course and made it an addition to DS.  This is part of why DST is the sequel to DS even though DS had an expansion afterwards.  That expansion wasn't supposed to be an expansion.  DS was done prior to that feedback.  Hamlet is in a similar boat - although they probably intended it to be a DS expansion from the onset, the game is basically a whole different game from DS.  These aren't "expansions" as much as they are side games released through that platform because the fans have voiced their preference for that model over buying stand alone games...  Hamlet didn't give DS more content as much as you loaded Hamlet through the DS client.

Meanwhile the DST content is actually a part of the core DST game.  Dfly is significantly reworked for dst, and they added bee queen, klaus, toadstool, shadow pieces, and ancient fuelweaver.  The boating and new island biome aren't a different world the way SW is, this is all actually added to a single gaming experience.

DST is not just multiplayer DS, the level of content when you load up a DS RoG game vs DST makes DST the clear successor and torchbearer.

They even say it themselves on the front page of the game

dstsequel.thumb.png.2ba4083fb789c4fea246cf2fc55c5b2a.png

And finally there is the real reason DST is considered the sequel, or "current version," and that is skins skins skins.  Even playing single player skins are a valuable asset to maintain enjoyment of a game after spending thousands of hours in game and repeating the first 100 days for the nth time.

DST is DS2

Edited by Shosuko
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Sunset Skye    7,251
58 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Hamlet didn't give DS more content as much as you loaded Hamlet through the DS client...

The boating and new island biome aren't a different world the way SW is, this is all actually added to a single gaming experience...

DST is not just multiplayer DS, the level of content when you load up a DS RoG game vs DST makes DST the clear successor.

These would be good points if the Sea/skyworthy and merged crafting didn't exist, but they do, so only comparing non-linked RoG up against all of DST is just silly. You talk about Hamlet and SW as if you're locked into them forever, but you're both able and encouraged to take the Skyworthy to other DLC worlds in the same file, and can go back and forth between all three as many times as you like, along with any items you can hold and any recipes you've learned. RoG + SW + Hamlet make up a complete experience, and of course leaving out 2/3 of that experience will make DST's look much better.

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Shosuko    940
14 hours ago, Sunset Skye said:

These would be good points if the Sea/skyworthy and merged crafting didn't exist, but they do, so only comparing non-linked RoG up against all of DST is just silly. You talk about Hamlet and SW as if you're locked into them forever, but you're both able and encouraged to take the Skyworthy to other DLC worlds in the same file, and can go back and forth between all three as many times as you like, along with any items you can hold and any recipes you've learned. RoG + SW + Hamlet make up a complete experience, and of course leaving out 2/3 of that experience will make DST's look much better.

Sure, you can change between worlds - but they are still essentially separate games.  Its not like going top side to the caves, its literally going to a whole different game.  DST is a single gaming experience, DS ended with RoG and you can add the SW and Hamlet experiences to them.

BUT regardless of whether it is a literal sequel, or only a "sort of sequel" which is exactly what the game says it is...

DST is not a multiplayer only game.  Looking at content only in the view of a multiplayer experience is a horrible position to have.  Whether you want to deny that DST is the sequel to DS or not, you can't deny that many, many people play DST solo.

Edited by Shosuko
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Sunset Skye    7,251
16 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Sure, you can change between worlds - but they are still essentially separate games.  Its not like going top side to the caves, its literally going to a whole different game.  DST is a single gaming experience, DS ended with RoG and you can add the SW and Hamlet experiences to them.

It's just like going between the surface and caves, though. You click the Skyworthy, choose your world, and all of your items and recipe knowledge are taken with you to that world. It's not stop-n-swop or anything, it's simply different worlds within the same game.

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Shosuko    940
1 hour ago, Sunset Skye said:

It's just like going between the surface and caves, though. You click the Skyworthy, choose your world, and all of your items and recipe knowledge are taken with you to that world. It's not stop-n-swop or anything, it's simply different worlds within the same game.

They are a lot more different then the caves and surface.  SW was literally designed to be a completely separate game.

Meanwhile many things have been added to the base world in DST and yet DS gets none of them... none at all... gee...

Edited by Shosuko
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CameoAppearance    1,539
3 hours ago, Shosuko said:

They are a lot more different then the caves and surface.  SW was literally designed to be a completely separate game.

It really doesn't matter what it was originally designed to be when you can go between them this easily now.

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Mike23Ua    3,014

Even though I don’t have nowhere near as much experience as some of you have with the game I still would like to voice my opinion on a handful of easily craftable items that I feel maybe too powerful considering how very few resources you Actually Need to craft them.

The first thing I would change is the Hammer, there’s nothing wrong with how it functions- it’s the fact that it can be obtained before creating an Alchemy Engine that I would change- Building one of these for the first time should require the gathering of Resources and then Refining them into the materials needed to create the Alchemy Engine, instead.. because of how much easier it is to get a Hammer- you only need to smash into a pig home to gather both the wooden planks and cut stones for the crafting requirements.

It is a small change, but one that could potentially make a world of difference.

The Next thing I would change or nerf is the Football Helmet, it takes too few resources to craft and provides too much protection, You don’t really ever need to use a grass, log or Marble Suit.. just craft a couple of these and your good to go!

Sewing Kits- These require a decent amount of resources to create, BUT they should only be able to repair cloth, and most defiantly Not Thermal Stones.

Lastly the Thermal Stone itself is pretty much all you need to survive Winter and Summer Seasons- Making Winter and Summer clothing items effectively useless to even bother with.. so maybe have it require some sort of Heating material such as Frazzled Wires and Electrical Doodads.. or some sort of cooling materials to craft either a Heat Stone or a Cooling Stone.. I just feel like it shouldn’t solve BOTH problems.

Which is where we come to the Umbrella and Straw Hat combination- these not only keep you from getting any wetness during the Spring, but combined with a Cold Thermal Stone are just enough to keep you cool all Summer long too. (Provided that you keep enough Endo fires going to keep the Thermal Stone Cold)

Another thing that should probably get a nerf is less of a weapon or item but more of a food recipe- but I’m listing it Anyway because it is incredibly overpowered and could defiantly use a nerf- and that is the crockpot Recipe for 3 Ice + any Random Meat source = MEATBALLS.

Anything combined with 3 Ice should always probably result in Wet Goop.

 

Thats all I can think of.. because as I said- I don’t have nowhere near as much experience in game as most of you probably have. But I Strongly STRONGLY feel that there shouldn’t be items such as the Thermal Stone, Umbrella+ Straw Hat Combo, that can solve two full seasons worth of the games struggles.

The TL:DR Give me a reason to even WANT to craft Summer or Winter Clothing..

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