themate28

What kind of buffs, nerfs or tweaks would you like to see in dst

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themate28    20
Just now, ShadowDuelist said:

Just by making birds give a guaranteed second specific seed the farms would get a strong enough buff. Its a simple change, and would make farming a lot more profitable and less tedious.

Yes please. Or they should be able to wear helmets.

armor sounds like an interesting idea. What if you could use nightmare fuel to increase their max health, almost like a wx-78 sort of thing 

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themate28    20
1 minute ago, Ogrecakes said:

Meatballs are overtuned, food in general is a bigger problem but meatballs are one big flaw I suppose.

Monster Meat and Ice in crock pots should be nerfed, I would love to have a ratatouille like mediocre food item for putting even a single monster meat in a crock pot, and wet goop for ice.

Feeding birds monster meat should be nerfed, as well as being able to feed them cooked eggs to receive fresh eggs.

Mainly, I want objects like fossils and gravestones to not have any mob collision so you cannot just glitch enemies like the Ancient Guardian on them.

Definitely change boss interactions with walls, especially the dragonfly's grubs.

Wickers books need a nerf too, I main Wicker but I hate feeling like I'm just downright overpowered tbh.

 

In terms of buffs, I would like to see buffs to items like the morning star and bat-bat, bee mines, and all those underutilized items.

Morning Star could use some beefed up damage against wet targets, or some better ways to make targets wet, the bat-bat's crafting recipe or sanity loss could be improved, bee mines could produce amped up bees instead of just regular killers, etc, etc.

 

 

Trying to think of general changes that benefit the game for pretty much everybody over personal preferences, because that list would exceed the character limit 3 times over.

As for the birds, maybe there should be a point system and when it reaches max, the bird produces an egg, maybe out of 3 for example. If a system like that existed, maybe monster meat & frog legs could be like 1 point. Idea I came up with on the spot, maybe it could be tweaked.

Bat-Bat buff would be great.

Ice and monster-meat are fine, meatballs are the real unbalanced thing here in my opinion 

 

 

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themate28    20
4 minutes ago, ShadowDuelist said:

I hope that they check some items balance in general. Like night armor not being worth using in general, or top tier weapons like thulecite club being too expensive when compared with Dark Sword.

I don't like the idea to alter the balance through nerfs, I think a mix of cost decrease and small buffs of certain items would get the right spot. EG: Night armor could cost just 1 papyrus instead of 3, and the sanity drain could be lowered to 5 sanity/minute instead of 10. That way it will be a strong high tier armor worth using, without making it OP or making it eclipse the thulecite armors.

Farms I think need a small reduction in the grass cost, since it's a bit ridiculous atm.

Beefalo taming also needs a devs re-visit, if you ask me. Not to oversimplify it, but at least tweak it to a less annoying point. Also a way to keep your tamed beefalo with you, so in a public server after you took all the effort, and you have to leave, it wont just die or get undomesticated.

I think night armor should go from 3 to 2 papyrus and i agree that the sanity drain should half.

Also farms should eat up less grass maybe make an improved farm cost 8, maybe even 6 (idk about 6)

1 minute ago, Nolgore said:

Possible unpopular opinion, but I wouldn't mind if the mainland was broken off into smaller landmasses, maybe 2 main continents that would require boats or cave travel to get to, and a few possible rare set piece islands.  Obviously crucial resources need to be on the starting continent. As of right now, sailing only really exists for the lunar island, which is a once and done adventure for the most part. There is probably more to come on that front, but still. I don't want it to be as sailing intense as Shipwrecked (though world gen settings making that possible would certainly be interesting!). 

I think food heals too much, I honestly kinda love playing as Wormwood so that I'm forced to heal with actual healing items. The Batbat is far more useful on Wormwood than it is on other characters, which is nice. Perogi spam is boring. If food was changed to a heal over time effect, I think that would be a good balance. 

Monster meat morsels, make easily farmable monsters just drop morsels, which have a lower meat value, but the same monster value, so using 2 will automatically make monster lasagna. 

Meatballs need to require more meat, it's dumb that a ball of meat only has to be 25% meat. Reasons to make different recipes would be nice too, but I'm not sure how to do that without encroaching on Warly's turf. 

Medium tier armor is a bit too good, I never really feel compelled to use anything other than football helms or a log suit in a pinch. I have never used a grass suit outside of finding one as a Boon.

 

Holy crap, those are a lot of good ideas 

1) I agree that 1 or 2 continents should be a thing, and the rare set piece islands too, but i just want more islands in general, they could be just islands that are only 1 already existing biomes, boats feel like they are only good for bridges RN, and I don't think adding all this fishing stuff (hook line and inker) will help boats be cool. Hell, maybe make some of the islands have naturally spawning potatos (kinda like sweet potatoes in shipwrecked) or maybe a swamp island with naturally growing onions idk.

2) Yeah, pirogi is really op, it should heal half as much

3) monster meat is kinda op in some ways too, hounds dropping monster meat morsel and tree guardians and varg dropping monster meat would be cool 

4) meat balls should require like 1.5 meat and 2 fillers 

5) ehhh, i think log suit should stay the same while other armor needs buffs, maybe grass suit could have non-combat uses, or have more armor health than log suit and get bumped from 60% to 65% resistance 

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themate28    20

 

2 minutes ago, SonicDen220 said:

I think all armor should've just had its normal durability from singleplayer instead of 70% of it. 

Water balloons need to affect all mobs (preferably setting their wetness to 1 instead of percentage like with players or dragonfly), morning star and electric darts need to be affected by goat jelly (I'm never gonna stop saying this)

Lazy forager needs to be refuelable.

...

Nothing else comes to mind yet, might edit this post if I think of something.

That water balloon buff idea is great 

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1bubbainpa    1,157

Probably something that would make alotta people upset, but Applied Horticulture is probably the most overpowered item in the game. 

For the low price of poop and seeds, you can not only generate 3 of the 4 basic resources immediately, but it can also basically ensure that nobody dies from starvation on the server. (Assuming they’ve passed natural selection.)

I don’t believe all of these nerfs should be applied together, but my potential ideas are:

1. Make the book more expensive to craft. Papyrus is somewhat hard to get in bulk amounts, but seeds and doo-doo are laughably easy to collect by just wandering the world. Maybe add something else to the recipe like Leafy Meat or a specific rare crop like dragonfruit.

2. Lower its range to around a flingomatic’s range.

3. Decrease its durability to 2-3 uses.

4. Have the penalty of sanity be harsher on wickerbottom.

Edited by 1bubbainpa
Mobile Spellcheck hates gamer words
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Owlrus98    448

I'm iffy on the subject of "buffs, nerfs, or changes" because I don't think the changes will ever find a place to stop. Meatballs are OP? Nerf em. Meatballs need a buff? Buff em. OP again? Nerf em once more. It's also kinda hard to balance things when opinions are well....diverse. In multiplayer competitive games, buffs and nerfs are needed to keep the game balanced and to change the current meta, usually defined by coordination from  both professional players and developers that determine the tweaks needed to alter the game in a way that encourages/discourages different team playstyles. It works really well in competitive games like Overwatch or LoL due to A.) The idea of their respective competitive scenes with ranking systems and tier lists that DST doesn't have, B.) The fact that matches are quick whereas DST is not, and C.) Changes are needed to remove exploits that enforce a playstyle upon the entire competitive scene (IE: you cannot play as "X" because you have to play as "Y" in order to counter "Z", and anything else will always result in a loss unless you do the same thing every single time). To reiterate on my first point (all in my own opinion of course) this game is neither a fast game you can get through in 30 minutes, and is not a competitive game; not to mention (as said previously) most people are divided on changes anyways (with some acting like they know better than anyone else to make matters worse). Now one thing I think would be a good example of a thing to tweak and buff/nerf at leasure in DST would be it's events. They are quick 30-40 min matches, rank characters up with experience, and can be used in the competitive scene. You cannot "win" DST, there is no "You Win!" message after any achievement you do; plus I like to think Klei has done amazing with how they handle changes, mainly considering how much they take creative imput and criticism alike. I (personally) have come to trust their judgement in the end on changes and balance.

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Gourmand    355

Maxwell needs to be reworked. Nothing about a former magician turned Shadow King turned disturbed survivor screams "resource gatherer." He needs his entire codex umbra to be reworked. No more shadow resource gatherers. Wickerbottom and Wortox feel more magical than the amazing Maxwell. Woodie is still not viable because Maxwell outclasses him. 

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Mike23Ua    1,077

They should nerf Abigails Curiosity for Death beyond Death and her extreme Stupidity.

seriously I get so sick of hearing people whine that Abigail is OP... Abigail is in actuality many times more annoying then she is helpful, like if there’s a bunch of dogs attacking you.. she’s just gonna tag along behind and watch unless you drag them to her.. assuming she doesn’t float away from you like she tends to want to do. It’s almost like she Blames Wendy for dying and just wants to observe Wendy suffer.

Seriously... you take Abigail in a Swamp to fight a few Spider dens, she gets distracted by ground tentacle that’s not even part of the battle, decides she wants to Attack that instead- Whittiers and Dies while all the Spiders she DIDN'T kill now guard over her flower daring Wendy to just come Try and pick it back up.

 

they should also nerf the ability to build boat bridges out to Lunar Island.. maybe put  hard limit of how many boats a player can create in a world such as 4-5?? And if they make any more past that one of the others is instantly destroyed. 

They should Buff Webber so he can tame and ride a Spider Queen, this would be his own personal Beefalo.. but to counter this- Beefalo should be hostile towards Webber so he can’t tame them in addition to SQ.

Lastly Buff Maxwells Shadows In multiplayer, I don’t even play as Maxwell because creating shadows is part of his Kit.. but other players can hit them ONCE and destroy them, wasting Maxwells Shadow fuel and sanity.. Abigail may be incredibly Dumb.. but at least she WILL kill the player that attempts to attack her.

Maybe make Maxwells shadows break apart and reassemble themselves like fighting the Terrorbeaks and Crawling Horrors when other players attempt to attack them.

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Nolgore    107

Regarding Maxwell, I've always thought it was kinda weird that his Shadow Duelists can't fight other shadow creatures. It would have given him the unique ability to have minions that help fight off the unending shadow tide. Unfortunately, now that Bernie is a shadow creature Terminator, allowing Maxwell's goons to fight them would have him stepping on another characters toes, which he already does with Woodie.

Giving Maxwell a few unique craftables from the Codex Umbra like Shadow Helmets would be cool, especially if these could be given to his duelists to give them a bit more survivability. Maybe a Shadow Staff that summons a Shadow Hand to grab a target. I don't know, there's a lot of unique things they could do with Shadow magic. 

To up the ante for his downsides, Shadow Creatures could focus target him, since I'm assuming his status as the fallen king would make him public enemy #1 for Them.

Apologies for going into rework ideas since this topic is more in the vein of tweaks rather than brand new mechanics. I'm so glad Klei is doing the character reworks though, I know some of them have been underwhelming, but I love the excitement of speculation!

Edit: 

Quote

they should also nerf the ability to build boat bridges out to Lunar Island.. maybe put  hard limit of how many boats a player can create in a world such as 4-5?? And if they make any more past that one of the others is instantly destroyed. 

I think a more interesting mechanic would be to have a dangerous enemy be summoned to areas with an accumulation of boats, sorta like how Deerclops will spawn on players that are near structures. This would still discourage the behavior without adding a hard limit to the amount of boats on the map. 

Edited by Nolgore
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Gourmand    355
50 minutes ago, Poebus said:

wurt shouldn't be effected by rain and wetness

Maybe not fully immune. She should have a natural resistance. Say, 50% or so. Sidenote: Wormwood needs a small health regeneration during rain.

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fimmatek    3,417
1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Seriously... you take Abigail in a Swamp to fight a few Spider dens,

You shouldn't, it's a bad decision. If you want to kill spiders with Abby, go in the pine woods, or the caves, that's where she excels.

57 minutes ago, Viktor234 said:

Wormwood shouldn't be affected by splumonkey manure.

She should. She should get health from each hit.

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Booklover    101

Food

Personally, I think that meatballs are okay since it follows the Meat principle of crockpot foods: restoring hunger. I mean, check every meat crockpot meal, they always restore alot of hunger or if they don't, they restore alot of health. Every meat crockpot meal restores at least 37.5 hunger and then it'll heal at least 20 health for that unless it's kabobs. Take a look at kabobs, meatballs and meaty stews. See the connection? Each one is easy to get (kabobs is a meat, twigs and 2 fillers, meatballs are... you should know it, meaty stews are just throw in as much meat in as you can) or make and each only focuses on one stat: hunger. The other meals always heal alot but they either are complicated to make (turkey dinner and if you think honey and eggs are hard to get, honey ham, nuggets and bacon and eggs) or heal way more than usual (pierOP). So technically meatballs are easier to get but are weaker versions of other crockpot meals. They are those "Welp, I'm at 10 hunger" foods that take 15 seconds to make. Fast, easy but not viable for stocking up foods. They spoil too fast and recover too much hunger to be eaten in such a short time.

Basically panic button foods.

Items

Now there are tons of items that were never used because it's too tedious or doesn't work well. A simple one is bat bat. The time needed to get this weapon is too long and is usually wasted due to how terrible the weapon performs. Low damage (compared to other more viable weapons), takes your sanity away and is only useful when you took damage, this is a tank weapon. It encourages bulking up with a marble suit and shelmet while standing still and smacking the enemy. Not to mention most of the health you recovered is wasted unless you're tanking a boss. It would be easier to just wear a football helm and log suit and just rely on healing foods like pierogi and kite the boss with a hambat. The fight not only ends quicker, you might not even be insane whereas it's guaranteed insanity with the bat bat. It's just not good. The problem isn't the bat bat, it's great design. The problem lies in how fighting in DST works. Unless you're new (then again you'll most likely run than fight), you won't tank the mobs. You would kite them. You can't really rework this since it's problem is fighting, not stats.

As for the morning star... the arrival of Warly and his magical lightning jelly sent this weapon from "meh, good for wet mobs" to "why bother?". The jelly buffs any weapon, increasing it's damage and basically gives any weapon what made the morning star slightly viable against wet mobs. The only positive about the morning star? You don't have to be or have a Warly to use it. It's main use would be charging the volt goats for their milk. Other than that... I don't know. My suggestion? Increase it's damage so it's nearly ham bat level (50?). This makes it strong enough that it could be considered for fighting normally and against wet mobs. Obviously our problem is Warly's goat jelly. Maybe Klei will do something about it? I doubt it.

In general the unused things are due to how we do things. You'd rather use bunnymen against a spider queen rather than dozens of bee mines. Or make a backpack over a piggyback. Some things just aren't "meta" or viable for our strategies and playstyles. And sometimes, we gotta accept that. It's either that or try to use all the unused items in your playthrough to prove that they're good.

Characters

Oooh now this is an intriguing topic. It's highly opiniated so ignore it or take it into account. We'll start with the so called "meta" characters.

Wickerbottom: You know what I'm gonna say before I'm even gonna type it. Her books. It's the cause of complaint and argument in the community. Nerf her? Or leave her be? For me, don't nerf her. Make her books something you need to work for. I mean, have you seen the recipe for Applied Horticulture? Some seeds and poop combined together with her starting items and you get... ta-da! 5 uses of instant regrow. Stand in a field of grass, use it and you don't need to gather grass anymore. The range is huge, the payoff is high, the recipe is cheap and the sanity cost is little. I would like Wickerbottom to do some unique quests (Someone suggested this, forgot their name but thanks person!) like study various plants (idk maybe interact with the plants like pick, dig up or chop them?) before you can get the full power of her books. Say, before doing the quest she can target an area to regrow but after doing the quest her book upgrades she gets a bigger area to target and if she targets an empty ground (like empty spots) she can grow random plants like forest stalker which disappear after a while. Increase the sanity cost of her books and make it so that she needs to be above a certain threshold to read her books. I mean, can you read while insane? Upgrades last forever until you leave the server and never come back. The uses are the same. I would like Wickerbottom to equip her books like in The Forge and use their abilities. Sanity cost... maybe 33 before upgrade and 50 after upgrade.

Applied Horticulture: Target an area to regrow. Quest: Interact with every plant at least once (picking or chopping them) including lunar island plants, cave plants and trees. Upgrade: Target a bigger area and regrow any plant inside. Grows a random plant if there is empty space inside the area. Plants grown this way disappear after 5-7 seconds but will delay their timer while being picked.

Birds of the world: Force birds into flying down in a circle around you. Birds spawned this way have twice the naughtiness when killed. Quest: Capture every type of bird, kill them and have their feathers in your inventory at least once and kill a pengull and a tallbird. Upgrade: Same thing as before upgrade but you can specifically target an area to have birds divebomb it. Each bird deals 10 damage and dies upon bombing. Their death is always caused by you unless you hit a mob or player with it. Then their death is caused by the mob or player. Yes, you can give players naughtiness but the amount of birds divebombing will never exceed the naughtiness meter.

Sleepytime stories: Target an area to sleep anyone in it. Wickerbottom will need to stand still to channel the stories or the mobs inside the area will wake up. Quest: Witness a Pig, Bunnymen, a Merm and the Pig King sleep. Players sleeping via bed rolls count as a Pig. Upgrade: You don't need to channel the stories anymore. Mobs woken while sleeping are slower in their actions (animations are slower).

On Tentacles: When you read the book somewhere around you (3X3 screens with you in the middle) 3 tentacles will spawn. Quest: Kill a tentacle with a tentacle spike and you need to have a tentacle spot in your inventory while doing so. You also need to get hit without armour once. Upgrade: You can target an area to summon 3 tentacles and 3 baby tentacles.

The End Is Nigh!: Summon 16 lightning strikes around you. Every other lightning strike will always target you and deal twice the damage. Quest: Get struck by lightning, witness a lightning rod getting struck and witness a volt goat getting charged by lightning. Upgrade: You can now target an area to bombard with 20 lightning strikes.

Just my thoughts. Might make her too strong but atleast you can't just join a server, pick her and then instantly be OP with her Applied Horticulture. Gives her a way to suicide with The End Is Nigh! and fricks the griefers if they use it. In fact, a usage of The End Is Nigh! without armour or lightningproof clothing will instantly kill you since 10X2X8 (lightning damage times two times the amount of lightning strikes) is 160 health gone. Still, after upgrade you can now slam 20 lightning strikes into WX78.

Wolfgang: Either remove his speed boost or remove his extra health. Wolfgang is supposed to be a pro kiter styled fighter and doesn't need the extra health. The extra health should've been given to Wigfrid instead since she's designed to tank.

WX78: Add a threshold to the amount of lightning strikes he can take (heheh you didn't think it would be easy to charge him with 20 lightning strikes did you?) to prevent silly tactics such as overcharging him forever so he'll be OP in Winter due to anti freezing and speedy abilities. Keep the health recovery and sanity loss though to make Wickerbottom a pseudo healer and WX78 a pseudo tank. Main reason to choose him is to ruins rush and well... Nothing I can really do about it.

Maxwell: BIG REWORK!! There's alot of things Klei can do with him. You can turn shadows into anything and I think he should be able to. The shadow puppets were nice but let's give Woodie the award he deserves alright? Maybe let Maxwell start with the knowledge of making Dark Sword, Night Armour and the ability to make nightmare fuel from evil flowers. I liked the idea of him being hunted by shadow creatures. Maybe shadow creatures hunt him even though he isn't insane and target him over other characters? He could be a makeshift Bernie. I want him to have more interactions with Charlie too.

Wendy: This is obvious too. Double Abigails's health to match the ones in DST. Make Abigail great again. Other than that maybe let Wendy interact with other ghosts? Instead of killing them she befriends them or something?

Wigfrid: I said this in the Wolfgang part. Let her have more health than him. She's a tank for god's sake. Her entire kit screams tank.

Webber: Make him have more interactions with Spider Queen. Kinda like Wurt maybe.

Warly: Is okay currently. Not much complaints. Only problem is the level of players playing him.

Wortox: No complaints so far. Pretty balanced and this is why you don't nerf meatballs. What would Wortox eat then?

Wormwood: Predictable. Healing while in rain. He's a plant so it's logical. If it's not logical then Klei better remove Wolfgang's extra health. I think that's the only reason he gets extra health: because he gets bigger.

Wurt: Currently no other complaint than please let her have a way to know her king's hunger. He's very shy and says very little.

Winona: No complaint. I don't play her and thus don't care about her.

That's all for now. Sorry for wall of text XD

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Frashaw27    491
5 hours ago, Gourmand said:

He needs his entire codex umbra to be reworked. No more shadow resource gatherers

I think the resource gathering puppets make total sense for Maxwell. He was a king so why would he do hard labour? He would instead make the puppets do it for him. Beside that, the gathering puppets have always been the draw of Maxwell since you can have 4 "people" harvesting at the same time while you just sort kick bacl amd collect. There main role of gathering was also in single player as a majoroty of their actions were either harvesting or fighting, so removing them would remove that draw from his character that they had always intended to be there.

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