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Denisetwin

Easiest Oil boil build that can be built in survival

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Denisetwin    74

Okay so I know all the cool kids are using steam now but despite two tries over the past year I haven't had what I'd consider a successful oil boil build and when I try searching, I'm having trouble finding builds that 1. Still work in QOL and 2. Can be built in survival game not just debug

Can I get a few links to builds that still work and I can use in my base?  I think there are some videos out there, but I need something I can pour over the layout/automation screens to see what's going on so a written post is best for me.  I'm not super concerned with the most efficient build, I just want one that will work and is possible to build outside debug.  Also, is it better with QOL to boil to petroleum or all the way to NG?

I just found an oil well with a water geyser directly above it in my current base and it has become my new goal.

thanks!

PS  Need one that does NOT use space materials!  I am no where near ready for space!

Edited by Denisetwin

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Denisetwin    74
20 minutes ago, 6Havok9 said:

Thank you.  I'm hoping for one that does not use space materials, I'm no where near space, I'll edit the original post as that's an important point I should have noted.  @Lifegrow 's video uses space materials. I'm watching JohnFrancis now but I'd have to figure out an alternate heat source as I don't have a volcano.  I do have a gold volcano, I can try it with that.

 

Edited by Denisetwin

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Neotuck    1,777

I have an oil boiler design that worked before the space update was added

This makes 2kg/s NG

I can't find a link to the original post but here's some pics from then

20180925200719_1.thumb.jpg.ff46168efb8ad8c2c4d3b88fc4e2ee96.jpg20180925200747_1.thumb.jpg.9a1c51401a91a4ea3432d3d0db5caf27.jpg20180925200808_1.thumb.jpg.f3ca93b131ee05dc3944980e36178343.jpg20180925200839_1.thumb.jpg.072719af9158b814df018731950e3b9e.jpg20180925200859_1.thumb.jpg.d1e798fc9891fa9868e596d42c517256.jpg20180925200913_1.thumb.jpg.623ae593ada3608c1b2ecc9820190114.jpg

20180925200936_1.thumb.jpg.bf1d104d12915b6da4678b3c1a4236e4.jpg

Edited by Neotuck
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lee1026    5

If you are trying to go all the way to natural gas, it is a bit tricky to do without space materials. A bit tricky as in I am not aware of a good way. You need a reliable heat source and a way of getting that heat source into your oil beyond petroleum boiling points. A volcano can work, but they are never in a convenient place.

 

If you want to go to petrol, you need a three stage setup, separated by doors. When each stage is done, the doors will open and oil will fall into the next layer. For materials, you need some steel and some petrol to jumpstart the system. As an ongoing cost, you need a plentiful supply of raw metal (seriously). If you are building this in survival, don't automatically control the doors since you will make mistakes in designing this, and dupe access into 400 degree areas is annoying. Instead, wire each door into a pressure sensor set to something absurd. By toggling the pressure sensor from below/above, the player have an instant automation switch.

 

In stage one, you have the crude enter via a liquid vent. You will want to use a liquid shutoff to control how much crude enters - the condition should be pressure under 2000kg. To heat the oil, we use a smelter, cooled with petrol. You will want to use automation on the smelter so that it only turns on when the coolant is under 410 degrees C, or else you risk bursting pipes and getting sour gas everywhere. Send the coolant into the first chamber via radiation pipes.  This will heat up the oil to 410 degrees, turning it into petrol. When it hits 405 degrees, open the doors to let it into the second chamber.

 

In stage two, you will need to cool down the oil so that you can touch it with a steel pump. For that, we use an simple loop of petrol. One end is our stage two,  and the other end is  the hot chamber of an steam turbine (recycle the steam with your favorite method - I use condensation because it feels less cheaty, but doors are going to be more efficient). As long as you are recycling the steam, the hot chamber of a steam turbine is going to around 230C, which is cool enough for a steel pump. We open the doors to let the petrol enter the third chamber when the petrol hits 235 degrees.

 

In the third stage, we simply pump the petrol out with a steel pump.

 

This setup served me well until I literally turned all of the iron ore in multiple biomes into refined iron and turned all the fossil on the map into steel. At that point, I had to switch over to using space materials, which made it a lot easier.

Edited by lee1026
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Neotuck    1,777

It might just be easier to build a pair of oil refineries in a air tight room and collect the NG that off gasses from them

All you need is to train 2 dupes as operators to keep them going and you'll have enough fuel to run 2 natural gas generators and 5 petroleum generators (more with smart battery automation)

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hpongledd    43

This is my attempt. (yes i know debug mode but should be ******* easy to build in survival)

Input: ~90degree oil
Flowrate: ~10kg/s (needs some adjusting because it stutters a bit, most probably the door for heat exchanger on the right should be horizontal)
Output: ~250degree petroleum
Automation: left thermosensor: 405degree (filter gate: 20sec), right thermosensor: 380 degree put in a kg of super coolant but can be any liquid. Regarding right thermo sensor, start at 100 degree and slowly increase temperatur to 380 elsewise the pipes are going to break and produce sour gas.
Materials: tungsen/ceramic
Location: at a place where you can create a giant pool of magma, the bigger the better!
Completly build in a vacuum

edit: based on @Neotuck's input its recommended to leave a vacuum row between the tiles and the magma. With that said, all the ceramic tiles could be replaced by igneous rock, making the build even more cost efficient. The doors can be left "naked" touching the magma.
 

Challenge for ppl that are bored: How could the temperature of petroleum reduced to below 125degree, so that a simple gold pump could be used?
 

20190211210839_1.thumb.jpg.64461fc46448e38c58b8af3ab5f55245.jpg20190211210810_1.thumb.jpg.5e67d9ea9f5ecee53b9add1871db4eef.jpg20190211210807_1.thumb.jpg.7a86679afdea84eddbd1da6e7bbaa65d.jpg

This is my sour gas build (its basically a minified version of Lifegrows version, i can give some details if ppl are interested in it):

20190211211940_1.thumb.jpg.c0a589c41b4bd04bcb91afc5f06bfb50.jpg

Happy tinkering!

Edited by hpongledd
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Neotuck    1,777
1 minute ago, hpongledd said:

This is my attempt. (yes i know debug mode but should be ******* easy to build in survival)

Input: ~90degree oil
Flowrate: ~10kg/s (needs some adjusting because it stutters a bit, most probably the door for heat exchanger on the right should be vertical)
Output: ~250degree petroleum
Automation: left thermosensor: 405degree (filter gate: 20sec), right thermosensor: 380 degree put in a kg of super coolant but can be basically any liquid. Regarding right thermo sensor, start at 100 degree and slowly increase temperatur to 380 elsewise the pipes are going to break and produce sour gas.
Completly build in a vacuum

Happy tinkering!

don't think this is possible without space materials

best insulators is ceramic and I doubt that will stop the lava from boiling the petroleum 

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hpongledd    43
39 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

don't think this is possible without space materials

best insulators is ceramic and I doubt that will stop the lava from boiling the petroleum 

wrong. ;) heating up the pipes slowly prevents breaking, but if feel insecure, you could leave a vacuum row between the lava and the tiles, this should prevent contact therefore heating it up or build a two tile layer or whatever. but it worked for more then 100 cycles of super speed.

 

Edited by hpongledd

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Neotuck    1,777
1 minute ago, hpongledd said:

wrong. ;) heating up the pipes slowly prevents breaking

slowly isn't stopping it, eventually the heat will transfer though the insulated tiles and boil the tank of petroleum

12 minutes ago, hpongledd said:

@Neotuck ere is the save file, check it out and tell me what you think. Hovel.sav

I think you sent the wrong save file, this is a cycle 1 with nothing built (debug or otherwise) 

20190211153302_1.thumb.jpg.04ed377da94ff3f7a377d78885dab8ed.jpg20190211153339_1.thumb.jpg.37a9d0d4e4ce750e5d767d69fc15046d.jpg

15 minutes ago, hpongledd said:

but it worked for more then 100 cycles of super speed.

what were the tiles made with?

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JohnFrancis    17
1 hour ago, Denisetwin said:

 I'd have to figure out an alternate heat source as I don't have a volcano.  I do have a gold volcano, I can try it with that.

I don't have the numbers on hand but I really doubt a gold volcano would produce enough heat to run even a 1KG/s boiler. Just use a pitcher pump in a vacuum move the geo thermal magma to the boiler. So long as the dupes are in exo suites they can carry the stuff. Just make sure where you pick it up and where you drop it off are in vacuum.

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Neotuck    1,777
25 minutes ago, hpongledd said:

This is my sour gas build (its basically a minified version of Lifegrows version, i can give some details if ppl are interested in it):

20190211211940_1.thumb.jpg.c0a589c41b4bd04bcb91afc5f06bfb50.jpg

Impressive but I don't think this can be made without space materials ether, the aquatuner alone will overheat unless it's built with niobium or thermium

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hpongledd    43
2 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

Impressive but I don't think this can be made without space materials ether, the aquatuner alone will overheat unless it's built with niobium or thermium

everything is made of thermium :p 

Attached the updated save file. One side note: its quite a while ago that i build those and you should treat them more as a prototype build rather then a fully developed build. Because i didnt bother to test all corner cases, but you get the idea. Im pretty sure with a bit of tinkering it should work just fine.

Hovel.sav

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Neotuck    1,777
7 minutes ago, hpongledd said:

Attached the updated save file. One side note: its quite a while ago that i build those and you should treat them more as a prototype build rather then a fully developed build. Because i didnt bother to test all corner cases, but you get the idea. Im pretty sure with a bit of tinkering it should work just fine.

I stand corrected, ceramics seem to do the job just fine

in fact it now seems pointless to build with insulation

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hpongledd    43
2 minutes ago, Neotuck said:

I stand corrected, ceramics seem to do the job just fine

in fact it now seems pointless to build with insulation

my favourite job in this forum: correcting Neotuck *hihi*

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Neotuck    1,777
8 minutes ago, hpongledd said:

my favourite job in this forum: correcting Neotuck *hihi*

well you earned this one:

well played my good sir! 

Image result for picard clapping gif

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biopon    74
2 hours ago, Denisetwin said:

I do have a gold volcano, I can try it with that.

A gold volcano will let you cook petrol at about 200g/sec, I don't think that's what you're after. 

You need an actual decent heat source. Try preheating your oil with heat leached from the bunker doors, and then cook the hot(ter) oil with heat harvested from the heat sinks that you can build under your rockets. Between these two phases, exchange heat between the final petrol and your oil going into the boiler. There is a big recent thread on counterflow heat exchange that should give you ideas on how to do this very efficiently.

If you have enough thermium for a liquid pump, this should be a piece of cake to put together.

If you don't want to mess with rocket heat sinks, or you don't launch often enough, you can also use a thermium aquatuner to produce the heat.

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MorsDux    74

I spent 150 cycles building priming finetuning my natgas generator in survival, at the end I was thinking I could have gone to space and back and build it with space materials in that time... :)

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biopon    74
4 minutes ago, MorsDux said:

finetuning my natgas generator

How did you do that without thermium?

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MorsDux    74
22 minutes ago, biopon said:

How did you do that without thermium?

Minor volcano, automation to close door for heat transfer. Oil dripping, gas expands in a tunnel with various heat exchangers. End of the tunnel a bunch of thermo regulator cooled hydrogen cools the sour gas to liquid methane. Liquid pump sends it to storage. Can be built a lot better but i stopped finetuning it once the gas flow was enough. It is probably around 500g/sec or so. Sulfur is picked up by sweeper and stored. Not sure what to do with it though. 

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biopon    74

Well, congrats. :) I thought about giving it a shot as I have a volcano on my current map, but sour gas has such bad conductivity that I decided to just go to space instead.

Sulfur, have you thought about just leaving it in the condensation chamber? There's no other use for it, and even though it's garbage thermally, it may as well add stability to the room.

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Mullematsch    80

On the topic of oil boilers. I just build my own design (using space materials etc.) going into it basically blind. Ignore the automation, it is an over-complicated mess but I would be really curious what the main mistakes are. I think I should have a vacuum seal between magma and heat chamber but overall I just tried to come up with my own solutions. Wonder how ****y the design is :D

image.thumb.png.d60462be7ae57e368c69c54920bb319b.png

It does give me more power than I could use though so that is good. 

MM2.sav

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MorsDux    74
14 minutes ago, biopon said:

Well, congrats. :) I thought about giving it a shot as I have a volcano on my current map, but sour gas has such bad conductivity that I decided to just go to space instead.

Sulfur, have you thought about just leaving it in the condensation chamber? There's no other use for it, and even though it's garbage thermally, it may as well add stability to the room.

Give it a go if you like to fiddle with stuff i enjoyed it. My sulfur takes some heat with it on the way out (going through diamond tiles)

 

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Saturnus    2,145

The absolutely best way to transport intense heat energy from one place to another without using space materials is obsidian or tungsten gas pipes with superheated steam. Steel can also be used if you have access to that. The steam is heated constantly in a loop pipe going through either a volcano or from the magma at the bottom. The only tricky part is to keep the gas pipes in a vacuum at all the way to where you need the heat to go. For cracking crude into petrol you need less than 1g/s superheated steam per 100g/s of crude.

Note you can also pump magma directly with a miniature pump but some would consider that an exploit.

Edited by Saturnus
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manganeko    3

Agree with LEE1026, you can't accomplish making natural gas without space materials, the super coolant specifically. 

Sour gas is what you get by just heating Petroleum, then you have to condense it into Methane by cooling it down to about -163℃ (I don't know any other coolant but super coolant can do this),  and heat it up again to get natural gas.

You can have a look at this from a Chinese guy for more information.

 

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