. . . Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 I won't be playing hamlet till Warbucks is added back, which may be never, but so be it! Removing characters is just something I can't support and if Warbucks gets a complete redesign (especially appearance and quotes wise) it's basically the same as removing him completely! Just because a character was historically accurate to what it was based off in the old times and people got offended a character was removed, I hate when companies do this kind of thing removing completely okay content because a few people got so offended.. Though, since Klei has been so great before I don't hate them for it, but it still saddens me if this is the road they're going to go down makes me worried that any future content will have to be baby-friendly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyJam Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Guys Warbucks is dead... If they planned on just changing him they wouldn't have removed him. Sure they may re add him later, but i really don't think so. For me Warbucks didn't fit into the game. He looked like temp art and really didn't change the way you play. I'm liking Woodworm but need more time to play him. This really feels like a lose lose for Klei. They keep Warbucks and people wont like him. They remove him and people wont be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrimbles Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 5 hours ago, lifetheuniverse said: If you say his skin color was questionable, I'll respond that that's literally a 5 minute fix in Photoshop. Not underestimating the work, you wouldn't have to go through the entire set, a simple Hue/Saturation shift on the head part of his assembled character sheet would be enough to see how it looks. His pros/cons needed work like everyone else; all the base characters are about to get updates in the coming months, and Wilba was just given changes. Bringing things up to speed is indeed part of game development. He 'had no personality' because his lines were changed after people complained. They then continued to complain until he was disabled because...well, obviously we can't let people exist who've made us offended in the past, right?That personality thing also didn't stop them from full-releasing Winona. It was very little to do with 'artistic integrity'. Klei simply got pressured because people can't take a joke...and to take a word from your book: "If you can't take a joke, this game isn't for you.". We literally come in and take over a world where tribal people were living relatively peacefully prior, desecrate ancient ruins for our convenience and slaughter small animals...and that's just a small portion of the base game, far before Hamlet. This game has always had 'offensive' elements; people just chose now to get offended because they saw an easy opportunity, and Klei has had more attention as of late. I'm half-expecting people to complain Pomegranates out of the game next. It isn't super-offensive or anything for content to be removed from a game over the associations people choose to make...I just think it's bewildering and a decision that's probably going to do the game/company more harm than good in the long run. Klei said they we're scrapping him and starting again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Shake Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 1 hour ago, SuperDavid said: They keep Warbucks and people wont like him. I dunno. When a character is added to DS, it's more than just in-game. They're part of the lineup, people get attached to them after playing a few games, and eventually, even if they aren't the best, everyone just accepts or embraces their existence. You can still have him there, and it won't hurt anyone, but if you remove him you'll risk getting on the bad side of the people who liked him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GetNerfedOn Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 We know that his creation and sacrifice will not be in vain. He shall be a character who always did his best despite the expectations of the community. His honor shall be assured. Let us keep him in our prayers, friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkylordElberich Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Just now, GetNerfedOn said: Though we mourn him now, we know he shall return soon with a blaze of glory. We know that his creation and sacrifice will not be in vain. he shall be a character who always did his best despite the expectations of the community. His honor shall be assured. Let us keep him in our prayers, friends. Aye... wise words indeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Shake Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 A new religion begins! The second coming of Warbuck's will soon commence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyJam Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Okay where did the devs say they are going to rework him? Because what i got from the update was that he has been scraped and replace with Wormwood. Are people just hoping or did i miss something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkylordElberich Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 4 minutes ago, JimmyJam said: Okay where did the devs say they are going to rework him? Because what i got from the update was that he has been scraped and replace with Wormwood. Are people just hoping or did i miss something? I just reread the post and... oh God, I think you're right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roosev Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 26 minutes ago, SkylordElberich said: I just reread the post and... oh God, I think you're right. Quote Klei: We weren't very happy with how Warbucks was working out. While trying to find ways to make him work, we decided that he just wasn't as interesting as we would like, and so we've made the decision to start from scratch with a new character. (which is Wormwood) O ****... this ain't good my boi warbucks better come back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4 Da LOLs Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 9 hours ago, Ogrecakes said: His art didn't fit the style, his perks made him a worse Maxwell, he had no personality, he had no flaws, he had no use outside of Hamlet. Walani and Woodlegs have a word for you tho i do think if he does come back (i hope) i just want him to fit artistically just like not bright orange maybe tweak his lines to rather than be a perfect person or a nationalist just make him have a superiority complex that quickly get in over his head like how the trailer showed him running away from the bats which will make him a better character maybe have that tie in with his new stats? 1 hour ago, Raspberry Milk said: A new religion begins! The second coming of Warbuck's will soon commence! *pulls out Codex Umbra with Warbucks's face on it 27 minutes ago, Roosev said: O ****... this ain't good my boi warbucks better come back i hope i would find it odd if he was kept in trailer tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SandvichSpy Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 1 hour ago, 4 Da LOLs said: Walani and Woodlegs have a word for you Woodlegs has a very cool design and unique perks that do change the way he plays (He's basically RNGesus). His design, funny quotes, useful perks and amazing voice are the reasons why he is my favorite character. Can't really say the same for Walani tho... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minespatch Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 2 hours ago, 4 Da LOLs said: i hope i would find it odd if he was kept in trailer tho Unless Klei has the same connections with Google to replace their video with a edited one on youtube, they can't do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4 Da LOLs Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Just now, minespatch said: Unless Klei has the same connections with Google to replace their video with a edited one on youtube, they can't do that. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Shake Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 4 hours ago, SkylordElberich said: I just reread the post and... oh God, I think you're right. Even if he does return, he won't be the same ol' Warbucks. A non-red Warbucks just won't be Warbucks to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MewUra Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 22 hours ago, Corazon said: Goodbye Warbucks and good riddance! Hahahah the same reaction i have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maradyne Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 14 hours ago, SuperDavid said: I hate when companies do this kind of thing removing completely okay content because a few people got so offended. 12 hours ago, Raspberry Milk said: I dunno. When a character is added to DS, it's more than just in-game. They're part of the lineup, people get attached to them after playing a few games, and eventually, even if they aren't the best, everyone just accepts or embraces their existence. You can still have him there, and it won't hurt anyone, but if you remove him you'll risk getting on the bad side of the people who liked him. I remember similar happening with League Of Legends a few times; actually pretty similar to how this scenario is likely to play out in the end. The Devs updated characters, but...the update was basically just removing those characters and replacing them with new characters sharing the old name. Gameplay, personality, pretty much everything but their basic silhouette. Irked a lot of people, and with the sheer amount of work that went into it, the team would've been better off leaving the old characters alone until they had better ideas on how to update the outdated characters while retaining what they were, and making new ones with the traits they were looking for in the ongoing plotlines. The loss of original Sion was the worst for me. Zombie Arnold Schwarzenegger was great at taunting people into making mistakes, and I pretty much use psychological warfare as a game mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ucw Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 12 hours ago, SkylordElberich said: I just reread the post and... oh God, I think you're right. Yup. Let's remove Warbucks and rework him = Let's remove Warbucks and replace him with a totally fantasy-based plant character that can't possibly create any controversy or conversation. I hope I'm wrong. I played Warbucks now and then, but no saves with him when the update went live. PS: love your signature Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AutumnPingo Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 Id like to contribute my 2c: Whats with the obsession with judging people of the past on modern standards? Especially after they're gone and cant defend themselves. You can agree that things people did in the past werent very moral in hindsight, without condemning them entirely. One day, something very minor we do today will be considered wildly offensive 100 years from now, do you want to be written off as evil by that generation? Or would you rather they judge you based on the information we have today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicko Hog Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 On 2/8/2019 at 6:05 PM, Warbucks said: I won't be playing hamlet till Warbucks is added back and nothing of value was lost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greggorizing Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 4 hours ago, Field Field said: and nothing of value was lost Imagine coming up to whats basically the funeral that fans of a character made and insulting somene who was upset over losing something he cared about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicko Hog Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspberry Shake Posted February 19, 2019 Author Share Posted February 19, 2019 12 hours ago, AutumnPingo said: Id like to contribute my 2c: Whats with the obsession with judging people of the past on modern standards? Especially after they're gone and cant defend themselves. You can agree that things people did in the past werent very moral in hindsight, without condemning them entirely. One day, something very minor we do today will be considered wildly offensive 100 years from now, do you want to be written off as evil by that generation? Or would you rather they judge you based on the information we have today? I do disagree with the entire "Warbucks if offensive" thing, but I don't really agree with that statement. The Hbomberguy Lovecraft video basically sums it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voyager156 Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 11 hours ago, Greggorizing said: Imagine coming up to whats basically the funeral that fans of a character made and insulting somene who was upset over losing something he cared about True, this is (in a way) a boorish move. But lets not be too sensitive. Because this is what get Warbacks removed in the first place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TemporaryMan Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 On 2/8/2019 at 12:44 PM, lifetheuniverse said: A character was disabled because some people didn't like to play him... On 2/8/2019 at 1:05 PM, lifetheuniverse said: It was very little to do with 'artistic integrity'. Klei simply got pressured because people can't take a joke.. I'm sorry, I've agreed with most of your more nuanced arguments in the other thread, but I've read the discussion about this top to bottom and I've only seen maybe two people actually say they found him offensive. Just two, and only after the argument had been going on for pages. An additional three said they were glad to see him gone, but didn't say whether they were personally offended or not. Otherwise I've seen abstract hypothetical discussion about how he might be offensive to someone, or how he doesn't match the degree of separation other characters have with addressing the evils of colonialism through some fantasy counterpart, so he doesn't really fit the style of the other characters. And I've seen the devs say he was cut because he was problematic and wasn't varied and interesting enough. But I haven't seen this supposed sinister mob "pressure" violating Klei's "aritstic integrity". This was Klei's choice, and a fairly reasonable one. Klei's made it clear they use a highly-iterative process, and it's a best-practice not to be afraid to throw work out if it isn't working, ideally sooner rather than later. This is speaking as someone who was down with having a colonial player character if it's clear he's an arrogant, hypocritical villain like Maxwell. But the way the upset at his removal is teetering into scapegoating and blaming others is giving me doubts. The way things are now, players who absolutely don't want to deal with a British colonialist whatsoever get what they want. Players who want a character that satirizes British colonialists have a mod that re-enables his code that remains in the game. Sounds good enough to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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