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Don't Starve Together Roadmap 2019

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FreyaMaluk    2,291
Just now, Sketched_Philo said:

I'm not sure if this was mentioned before, but character stats and abilities could be different when playing on a server with PvP enabled. That way it wouldn't conflict with the PvE balancing. So the PvP rework would be small AND not affect PvE at all if done like this.

To give an example, Abigail does 25% of her damage when attacking players(maxwell duelists don't have it and now I'm crying), and the werebeaver also has PvP damage penalties that only come into play in PvP. I would never argue these have affected my PvE experience in any way.

Also, Klei didn't state whether the update can touch on PvP or not. I'd assume it's up on the table for consideration.

pls suggest this in the suggestions section.. it belongs there

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Sketched_Philo    836
4 minutes ago, FreyaMaluk said:

pls suggest this in the suggestions section.. it belongs there

This is relevant to the current discussion, so I will post it here.

I also have a persistent suspicion that the suggestions channel doesn't get much attention from the developers......

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ImDaMisterL    19,401
1 hour ago, Sketched_Philo said:

I also have a persistent suspicion that the suggestions channel doesn't get much attention from the developers......

They might not post much there, but they read it, don't worry.

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6 hours ago, FreyaMaluk said:

 

Pls open another thread in the suggestions.. But don't try to impose urgency for a change that would be irrelevant to the vast majority of players. 

As you said before, PvP is still a fun OPTION and it will still remain to be. But this character Update is not about that. 

I'm just gonna have to touch up on these statements you said:

If it was changed, it would not be irrelevant at all. If klei were to listen to us and create a more balanced, better experience for PvP, people are gonna play it. Think about it, if there is a balanced system where no matter what character you use, you can win. Each character has a weakness and the strong extra damage characters (Wolfgang, Wigfrid) or characters with a gimmick that can either create an imbalance in the system, in terms of PvP, (Wortox, Wickerbottom) would be slightly toned down and have an easy counter to them. For example, Wicker would have more start up time on Sleepytime Stories and the spell is released on, let's say, frame 20 or longer of that animation, but retains its range. That way, a player can easily counter her if they see her, making it not broken and a fair way to balance it out. If new or old players see that PvP has been changed for easier and more fair combat, it would become anything but irrelevant, attracting old and new players alike.

 

Like I said before, it can become enhanced and popularized by Klei. They have all the power to do such a course of action, and I can assure you, a PvP rework would keep the game fresh and interesting, because maybe you wanna see your favorite iconic Don't Starve characters duke it out with a various selection of weapons, armor, strategies, or maybe you want an extra twist to your typical survival. If these things were to be tinkered, we would have a perfect survival game. That way, you can choose between a fair PvE system and a fair PvP system so that both fans of those modes can enjoy what they want. This character update could include ways to balance out PvP, like I said, toning down imbalances, and creating characters that can be fit for a fighting environment, much like @Sketched_Philo's point. It wouldn't be irrelevant at all if PvP was tinkered and I can assure you, player numbers would rise. Some players might not be into the whole shtick of building bases and just surviving, and a lot of players wanna have an experience similar to that of PvP survival games, such as Rust, Minecraft, etc. 

DST has the potential to become an excellent PvE and PvP game with both modes focused on one thing: teamwork. You can form alliances in PvP, which still remains it's team orientated title, and PvE, of course, working together. 

 

In conclusion, Klei has all the power to use this character update to update PvP's system. Of course, I believe that it should be focused on after all the characters on their agenda are rebalanced, and then touch up on PvP. All of the cast of this game are unique in their own way, and changing them slightly for specifically PvP can keep the game fresh and new for old and new players alike.

Edited by AnnoyingAudience
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FreyaMaluk    2,291
1 hour ago, AnnoyingAudience said:

I'm just gonna have to touch up on these statements you said:

If it was changed, it would not be irrelevant at all. If klei were to listen to us and create a more balanced, better experience for PvP, people are gonna play it. Think about it, if there is a balanced system where no matter what character you use, you can win. Each character has a weakness and the strong extra damage characters (Wolfgang, Wigfrid) or characters with a gimmick that can either create an imbalance in the system, in terms of PvP, (Wortox, Wickerbottom) would be slightly toned down and have an easy counter to them. For example, Wicker would have more start up time on Sleepytime Stories and the spell is released on, let's say, frame 20 or longer of that animation, but retains its range. That way, a player can easily counter her if they see her, making it not broken and a fair way to balance it out. If new or old players see that PvP has been changed for easier and more fair combat, it would become anything but irrelevant, attracting old and new players alike.

 

Like I said before, it can become enhanced and popularized by Klei. They have all the power to do such a course of action, and I can assure you, a PvP rework would keep the game fresh and interesting, because maybe you wanna see your favorite iconic Don't Starve characters duke it out with a various selection of weapons, armor, strategies, or maybe you want an extra twist to your typical survival. If these things were to be tinkered, we would have a perfect survival game. That way, you can choose between a fair PvE system and a fair PvP system so that both fans of those modes can enjoy what they want. This character update could include ways to balance out PvP, like I said, toning down imbalances, and creating characters that can be fit for a fighting environment, much like @Sketched_Philo's point. It wouldn't be irrelevant at all if PvP was tinkered and I can assure you, player numbers would rise. Some players might not be into the whole shtick of building bases and just surviving, and a lot of players wanna have an experience similar to that of PvP survival games, such as Rust, Minecraft, etc. 

DST has the potential to become an excellent PvE and PvP game with both modes focused on one thing: teamwork. You can form alliances in PvP, which still remains it's team orientated title, and PvE, of course, working together. 

 

In conclusion, Klei has all the power to use this character update to update PvP's system. Of course, I believe that it should be focused on after all the characters on their agenda are rebalanced, and then touch up on PvP. All of the cast of this game are unique in their own way, and changing them slightly for specifically PvP can keep the game fresh and new for old and new players alike.

All these changes are major.. This is gonna take a huge amount of Dev time for an underused feature

And after so much time of waiting for a rebalance for the 97% of the Player base, why should the devs pay any pressing attention to an underused feature that only 3% or less cares about. 

That's why I ask you to place this on the suggestions... Cuz this would require a change of focus for another update 

Rn PvE should take precedence. 

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1 hour ago, FreyaMaluk said:

All these changes are major.. This is gonna take a huge amount of Dev time for an underused feature

And after so much time of waiting for a rebalance for the 97% of the Player base, why should the devs pay any pressing attention to an underused feature that only 3% or less cares about. 

That's why I ask you to place this on the suggestions... Cuz this would require a change of focus for another update 

Rn PvE should take precedence. 

Okay but you clearly missed my point about how if Klei worked on PvP it's player base would increase dramatically. The only reason of why PvP is that 3% you stated is because of how PvP is left in the dust. PvP has never gotten any love besides just being slapped onto the side bar to where you can look for a server. Of course the community is gonna ignore PvP because, once again, it has NEVER been tweaked, fixed, or paid any attention to, because Klei never acknowledged it's existence, and was just shoehorned into the game, and collected dust. But, this mode is iconic throughout video games, and it has TONS of potential to be something big. If Klei were to popularize PvP servers with official balancing, tweaks, and new content, I can assure you, PvP, and DST in general, would be filled to the brim with players. They have official Klei PvE servers, so why not add official Klei PvP servers to duke out with your friends? Clearly by this whole roadmap, Klei is listening and Klei is giving us what we want. We asked for character rebalances, and we are getting those. I think that this is a perfect opportunity to let Klei know that when they are finished with whatever they got for us, they should look into PvP some more. PvP has always been a feature in video games that has kept players around for so much longer. 

 

And about the whole official Klei PvP servers, Klei should just use those servers to tinker characters with disadvantages over other characters, nerf those a teeny bit while still keeping originality to those said characters, much like in my last post, and make it a whole balanced fight of fun. Much like the Strictly Unprofessional PvP server, they completely removed the Pan Flute and changed a few things to make the game more fun. A prime example of one of their notable changes, besides the Pan Flute change, is they nerfed the range of Wickerbottom's main gimmick, the books, or more specifically, Sleepytime Stories. If they can do it, I know Klei can. Once more, Klei has the power and the community to do this, and this whole thing can make the game 1000x more fun for all players.  

 

In conclusion, the reason of why PvP gets only that "3%" you stated, is because it is completely left in the dust, but it does not have to be this way. Don't Starve Together can be a PvE/PvP game, with both of those modes getting equal amounts of love.

Edited by AnnoyingAudience
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5 hours ago, Sketched_Philo said:

I'm not sure if this was mentioned before, but character stats and abilities could be different when playing on a server with PvP enabled. That way it wouldn't conflict with the PvE balancing. So the PvP rework would be small AND not affect PvE at all if done like this.

I like being able to turn the PvP setting on or off depending on what I'm doing in my world. Having different stats would disable that option. 

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6 days left in April. No news yet. :(

A confirmation that something is coming would be nice. A teaser trailer. Anything. How long after the new content drops will PS4 actually get it?

 

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x0VERSUS1y    2,023
33 minutes ago, AnnoyingAudience said:

..if Klei worked on PvP it's player base would increase dramatically. The only reason of why PvP is that 3% you stated..

Do you have any factual evidence backing up your "if Klei worked on PvP it's player base would increase dramatically"?

What that "dramatically" means in relation to mentioned (and verifiable) 1-4% current PvP online servers?

 

Is there a hidden bulk of PvPers just waiting to buy DST only for the PvP aspect - and you know of it because..?

Is there a significant percentage in current player-base just waiting the opportunity to jump into a "bran new and reworked PvP" - and if so where is your evidence?

Is there a consistent and dedicated PvP community out there? Some examples?

Is there a pretty big PvP mod-balance team and the like out there with Steam Grups and whatnot - examples?

 

You know, backing up your claim beyond "I believe since ...Minecraft has?!" (furthermore what "big PvP community in MInecraft" amounts to: what's the effective percentage of PvPlayers in Minecraft related to its total active player-base to have a standard of sorts)

 

Because, again: when you repeatedly ask a small developer team like Klei to prioritize a minimal/side-dish aspect of DST in an already seemingly tight and full-to-the-brim schedule, and they decide to cater by some miracle, you will surely get additional delays. Basically an investment with pretty big demand on resources yet more than questionable probable returns/profit - once more this being my ultimate concern: surplus delays in update releases.

 

 

And pls don't just get your pro-PvP "wannabe bandwagony" lobbyist duo Crimson Chin and Lillyth friends as back-up "evidence" posters, plus their new BeanBagSonic addition, this approach is getting tiresome by this point.

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The team is now working on brand new content for Don’t Starve Together. Survivors will be able to travel to new lands with new biomes, creatures, and more. 

The first drop of this new content will come in mid-April, and we will continually be adding to the content every couple months afterward.

 

”Mid-April”, posted on January 22. When will I see the update? In July? Ps4 update in September?  Posting some kind of news would be considerate. 

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BeanBagSonic    23
1 hour ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

Do you have any factual evidence backing up your "if Klei worked on PvP it's player base would increase dramatically"?

What that "dramatically" means in relation to mentioned (and verifiable) 1-4% current PvP online servers?

There are a fair amount of people, however small or large that number may be, that do enjoy playing PvP in DST. In fact, most of them who do don't approach the Klei forums due to regular forumers such as yourself that talk down and belittle the newer forumers who have been long time players and short time forumers, which in all honesty is quite disheartening. I myself haven't had the courage to make an account because of all the toxicity portrayed by not just yourself, but other regular forumers who seem to argue against points without thoroughly reading posts for the sake of arguing, possibly to maintain the status of a respected Senior Member. I'm sorry if this comes off as somewhat offensive, but can the Senior Members please climb off their high horse for a moment and take into account what the minorities have to say too?

1 hour ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

Is there a hidden bulk of PvPers just waiting to buy DST only for the PvP aspect - and you know of it because..?

Is there a significant percentage in current player-base just waiting the opportunity to jump into a "bran new and reworked PvP" - and if so where is your evidence?

Is there a consistent and dedicated PvP community out there? Some examples?

Is there a pretty big PvP mod-balance team and the like out there with Steam Grups and whatnot - examples?

There are a bulk of PvPers who have DST but are still waiting for its PvP aspect, and we know of this because of players, both in the forums and out, that have expressed their opinions about PvP being a fun feature that isn't fully fleshed out. Now, this is another concerning point: Why should a percentage of people be neglected when that would equate to neglecting a percentage of not just initial game sales, but also in-game transactions for DST. We would provide visual evidence of people who like PvP, but previous ones that have expressed their thoughts on PvP were immediately shut down by people such as yourself. Either way, if there were a more PvP-friendly forum out there, there would be your evidence. As was mentioned prior, Strictly Unprofessional was a great example of a thriving PvP community, where back in its day it had a maximum capacity of 45 players, I believe, and it was at its peak of 42 out of 45 players, and let me tell you it was a thrill to have been in that match! As for PvP mods, there shouldn't ideally be a large modding group because mods don't fix a game's problems, it merely masks them.

1 hour ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

You know, backing up your claim beyond "I believe since ...Minecraft has?!" (furthermore what "big PvP community in MInecraft" amounts to: what's the effective percentage of PvPlayers in Minecraft related to its total active player-base to have a standard of sorts)

You're bringing up percentages again, which is, as I've stated already, a denial of a percentage of sales for either the game or in-game content for said game. I don't know why we would want to exclude a percentage of customers from a game—Don't Starve Together—that we all like. I suppose that would be my question to you: Why do you want to exclude a percentage of players from the game we like so much?

1 hour ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

Because, again: when you repeatedly ask a small developer team like Klei to prioritize a minimal/side-dish aspect of DST in an already seemingly tight and full-to-the-brim schedule, and they decide to cater by some miracle, you will surely get additional delays. Basically an investment with pretty big demand on resources yet more than questionable probable returns/profit - once more this being my ultimate concern: surplus delays in update releases.

I think this point needs to be clarified. My opinion is that PvP shouldn't exactly be a priority more than it should be a consideration. What I mean by that is that though of course the addition of new biomes and general content for PvE should be the priority, PvP should also be considered within Klei's pool of ideas for the next big update. Now, I'm not sure how you know exactly how Klei's dynamic works for you to state as a fact that Klei can't do this and can't do that due to resources and whatnot, but for someone who likes DST that mentality comes off as more pessimistic than anything. I personally would like to believe that Klei can achieve quite a lot if given the time, and if that means more delays, so be it. You can refer to Shigeru Miyamoto's quote not as set-in-stone, but as a sentiment that can apply to DST's state: "A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad." Another way to alleviate the concern of delayed content is to have more communication with the players, even if it's a small post saying that there's a small issue, or that everything's going slowly, but going great, that's what I'd want to see. Basically, any form of new content will either have or not have some form of returns/profit, and I can understand your concern there, but there have been flops when it came to PvE content too (a Toadstool that will not be named), so it's always better to be open-minded about anything and consider both the good and the bad of all things, PvE and PvP.

1 hour ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

And pls don't just get your pro-PvP "wannabe bandwagony" lobbyist duo Crimson Chin and Lillyth friends as back-up "evidence" posters, plus their new BeanBagSonic addition, this approach is getting tiresome by this point.

Once again you seem to be name-calling, which with your currently unpleasant attitude is rather upsetting. Not only is this last post outright slanderous and unnecessary, but it's also contradicting your desire for "PvPers" to gather evidence of other players who enjoy PvP. If this is all tiresome for you, you can simply stop posting direct jabs at forumers who enjoy PvP and, in your words, "move on" from this thread.

Edited by BeanBagSonic
Grammatical Correction
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x0VERSUS1y    2,023
1 hour ago, BeanBagSonic said:

Why do you want to exclude a percentage of players from the game we like so much?

It's not about exclusion per se, but priority. Making something peripheral a priority requires a solid motive - and I for one don't see it in PvP's case. If is not about priority like Trenix put it ("Please focus on.. PvP"), but consideration as you frame it, sure. No quarrel there.

 

1 hour ago, BeanBagSonic said:

Once again you seem to be name-calling, which with your currently unpleasant attitude is rather upsetting. Not only is this last post outright slanderous and unnecessary, but it's also contradicting your desire for "PvPers" to gather evidence of other players who enjoy PvP. If this is all tiresome for you, you can simply stop posting direct jabs at forumers who enjoy PvP and, in your words, "move on" from this thread.

Your "name-calling" is citation or to be precise punctual enumeration (who wants it) of actual people that seem avidly pro-PvP and only posting about it. People that seem to take everything too personal and only reinforce stereotypes regarding volatility of PvPlayers.

 

 

52 minutes ago, Trenix said:

I believe PvP and PvE should be balanced together, rather than having separate game modes. Of course, PvP should still be optional.

By that you mean massive character nerfs, right? To be first and foremost PvP-balanced as a start for everything else. Not 2 separate type of balance, the one taking place this year for PvE and another separate strictly-mechanical one for proper PvP, but just a general one where all characters are brought to a more-or-less common denominator? Hmmm..

Edited by x0VERSUS1y
*additions and corrections*
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Trenix    189
3 hours ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

By that you mean massive character nerfs, right? To be first and foremost PvP-balanced as a start for everything else. Not 2 separate type of balance, the one taking place this year for PvE and another separate strictly-mechanical one for proper PvP, but just a general one where all characters are brought to a more-or-less common denominator? Hmmm..

I'm not sure how there is a massive character nerfs required. As of now, it seems like all characters are being properly re-balanced. Maybe it's a good idea to balance them and make every character viable and good in their own right, before PvP gets implemented properly. After that, balancing can be rather easy. Simply use items to differentiate between player damage and mob damage. That way, you can scale DPS differently based on what's PvP and what isn't. Another thing this will allow is for the developers to add CC effects to players from certain items, but not mobs.

Like using a weapon to stun or slow a player temporarily close range. Another thing that PvP desperately needs, is a way to net players or hit them with a ranged attack in attempt to slow them. Something as simple as being able to throw a spear would help quite a bit, maybe it should only be possible for PvP, but not PvE. Honestly it's very easy to re-blance the game. Just maybe, I might work on a mod to show what could be possible with the game if it had PvP within it. Yet things like this kind of push me back, because why would I mod a game when I can use that effort and time into other projects which can directly benefit me. Maybe I'll ask for donations, otherwise it's just not worth it.

The real sad part is that PvP would work extremely well in a game like this. Jungle Troll Tribes was an extremely popular custom map in Warcraft III. Developers at the very least consider some paid DLC as a spinoff for PvP players. I'd buy. You have everything you need to remake a classic that will sell and be potentially just as popular, if not more popular than this current game. I really wouldn't want it to be a different game, because it will separate the player-base with very little gain, though anything is better than nothing.

Edited by Trenix
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Pop Guy    473

Serious moment: Perhaps the PvP could be changed by partly recycling the Forge: a large arena where two teams of three players beat each other. The weapons are the same as the Forge (they were well balanced) with a life bracket each team.
On paper it seems funny and not too demanding to accomplish :D

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Trenix    189
Just now, Pop Guy said:

Serious moment: Perhaps the PvP could be changed by partly recycling the Forge: a large arena where two teams of three players beat each other. The weapons are the same as the Forge (they were well balanced) with a life bracket each team.
On paper it seems funny and not too demanding to accomplish :D

Yeah that was something I suggested in the suggestion forum. However I do feel that the wilderness game mode needs to be put into use, since it's actually the best thing for PvP. For Endless, it's more of a social thing. For survival, you're not going to kill someone who will drain your sanity afterwards. In Wilderness, you're thrown in the middle of nowhere and you survive. If you die, you create a new character and start from scratch.

I've actually tried this before and believe it or not, it really was fun because you saw random empty bases around the world and took advantage with what was available. Having a game mode for some tribal warfare would be great, but we also need some never ending PvP.

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Pop Guy    473
2 minutes ago, BeanBagSonic said:

Haha, you beat me to it! I was going to more or less say the same thing: It would be great to see the Forge and Gorge mechanics/assets being incorporated into the base game somehow. I personally really, really miss the Gorge cooking stations, and the meals. Their sprite work was fantastic, and I really miss them. Heck, I would toss all my money for a chef character, and that's a character idea that already exists!

  Reveal hidden contents

Imagine handing a cheeseburger to a starving Day 1 Wilson...

 

Although some still say that events were marginal, negligible or even ugly things, I consider them the highest points ever reached by DST. Defeating the Grand Forge Boarrior after four days of the first season of the Forge made me rejoice with friends such as rarely made me rejoice a game.
I think DST should have evolved in that direction: there you played together. There you cooperate. Six warriors against the horrors of the Constant.:afro:

3 minutes ago, Hatano Eichero said:

Geez. When I posted "Beanbag I love you" I got this.

sfasdfasdnfjadnfjsdndfnsdfjkasndfknasdjkfn

[...]

It's a private discussion, I don't know if you should share it without asking Freya... :confused:

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