Hydroponic Farm for Sleet Wheat seems broken / un balanced.

[MythN7]

I am thinking these farms should not need liquid irrigation.

It requires a min of 5 deg to grow. and as far as -55, my pipes going to this farm are constantly taking damage from the fluid going under 0 and freezing in the pipe.

Is this plant possible to have setup in this farm tile?

I suggest it use ice resource as its irrigation source that your dups would load in as such the fertilizer.

[marcjhune22]

4 hours ago, MythN7 said:

It requires a min of 5 deg to grow. and as far as -55, my pipes going to this farm are constantly taking damage from the fluid going under 0 and freezing in the pipe.

Is this plant possible to have setup in this farm tile?

use abyssalite tiles to prevent freezing damage to the pipes. yes, but irrigating one would be a waste of my water.

[Kasuha]

6 hours ago, MythN7 said:

my pipes going to this farm are constantly taking damage from the fluid going under 0 and freezing in the pipe.

Use abyssalite pipes. I think that's the only practical option, both to prevent the water freezing and to prevent the pipes heating up the farm (it will still get heated by the plants). The water has no heat effects once it gets deposited in the farm tile.

[Coolthulhu]

6 hours ago, Kasuha said:

The water has no heat effects once it gets deposited in the farm tile.

You sure? From what I saw, my farms fed overheated water from abyssalite pipes still become warmer than the surrounding air.

From what I can tell, standing water does heat farms up, just that water consumption doesn't (as in, water that disappears doesn't leave any heat behind).

[Kasuha]

25 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said:

You sure? From what I saw, my farms fed overheated water from abyssalite pipes still become warmer than the surrounding air.

From what I can tell, standing water does heat farms up, just that water consumption doesn't (as in, water that disappears doesn't leave any heat behind).

I'm pretty sure about it. Though if you prove me wrong, I will be happy to learn new things about the game.

First of all I'd recommend you to check that your pipes are really abyssalite all the way to the end, and also check temperature of the very ends of these pipes. There is non-zero thermal transfer between tiles and pipes, even if abyssalite is involved. It's possible that your tile heats up from that abyssalite pipe.

[MythN7]

4 hours ago, Kasuha said:

I'm pretty sure about it. Though if you prove me wrong, I will be happy to learn new things about the game.

First of all I'd recommend you to check that your pipes are really abyssalite all the way to the end, and also check temperature of the very ends of these pipes. There is non-zero thermal transfer between tiles and pipes, even if abyssalite is involved. It's possible that your tile heats up from that abyssalite pipe.

So how does that type of pipe help? all the info says is resist temp +2000

The issue is the pipes are breaking from the water going below 0 it seems.

So, to maintain your sleet at like -20 ish, it seems much better to just use the farm plot and maintain the perfect temp and air pressure.

I have my water being droped in a pool, with a heat tube thing in case the water freezes into blocks. so that i can maintain it at 1-10 deg.  then i use a pump to send the cooled water up to the plants, so that im not putting 20 deg water in making the plant say stiffled from the heat.

Just seems like a poor design to need to water a plant that thrives in very low sub 0 temps

[boggers]

The design of the plant though is that you don't need to water it. In contrast, you need to get bristle blossoms up to ideal conditions to gain seeds and extend your farm, but with sleet wheat you can extend exponentially each harvest with just standard yield, so you don't really need excellent or even good yields from it.

After the freezing pipe problem, I tried putting sleet wheat in regular farm tiles, and even had the fertiliser sitting in cold storage, but found that dupes going up there to fertilise it all the time messed with the ambient temperature too much, so now I just grow them in planter boxes, it's less work for the dupes and similar gains with the occasional good yield from pressure and temperature regulation.

[Kasuha]

20 minutes ago, MythN7 said:

The issue is the pipes are breaking from the water going below 0 it seems.

Yes but heat transfer of abyssalite is so abysmal that pipes made of it are safe to hold water in cold environment for hundreds of cycles. They don't exchange heat with their contents, and they don't exchange heat with environment. Almost. Next to nothing.

[MythN7]

ok, ill try that.

[Coolthulhu]

On 19.06.2017 at 1:28 PM, Kasuha said:

I'm pretty sure about it. Though if you prove me wrong, I will be happy to learn new things about the game.

Just tested it and it looks like you're right. I irrigated a wolframite farm with magma and it didn't seem to have any heat transfer..

I also learned something new: hydroponic farms seem to be gas-permeable.

[Chris_Hoefler]

It took me a while to get the right setup for sleet wheat. I always thought that the temperature of the plants are important which isn't quite true, it's the air temperature around which matters. By putting insulated abyssalite pipes through the ice biome I manage to keep stable temperatures around -4 to -8 °C and I had no issues with frozen pipes as well. Works charming

[Kasuha]

2 hours ago, Coolthulhu said:

hydroponic farms seem to be gas-permeable

It doesn't seem to me to be the case, though there are common traits. If you keep clicking on gas permeable or mesh tiles, you eventually get to the underlying gas or liquid tile which isn't listed in tooltips. In case of hydroponic farm that appears to be a solid tile made of the farm's material though.

That would make them "solid-permeable" perhaps? I also wonder how is it about their thermal capacity, if they act as if there is twice the material.

[Kasuha]

20 minutes ago, Kasuha said:

I also wonder how is it about their thermal capacity, if they act as if there is twice the material.

Tested that, there's "once" the material. They act as a tile, i.e. their "thermal mass" equals the reported mass.

[Coolthulhu]

3 hours ago, Kasuha said:

It doesn't seem to me to be the case, though there are common traits. If you keep clicking on gas permeable or mesh tiles, you eventually get to the underlying gas or liquid tile which isn't listed in tooltips. In case of hydroponic farm that appears to be a solid tile made of the farm's material though.

That would make them "solid-permeable" perhaps? I also wonder how is it about their thermal capacity, if they act as if there is twice the material.

I re-checked it and it looks like that gas permeability depends on something. Possibly just a debug mode thing, as it didn't seem to happen in a regular game.

As for the solid-permeability: that isn't exactly correct either, as tiles also "contain their material" - you can see the contained materials by mousing over the lowest pixel of a tile (could depend on zoom level) or cycling through all materials.

I assume that gas permeability only happens in debug mode because debug mode may not spawn the underlying material properly.

On a side note, cycling through large amounts of stuff gets slightly buggy - sort order differs from the "display order". This happens frequently in my Hatch pits, where I dump all the hatches on one tile.

[Kasuha]

Just now, Coolthulhu said:

I re-checked it and it looks like that gas permeability depends on something. Possibly just a debug mode thing, as it didn't seem to happen in a regular game.

Make sure you don't paint gas over wall tiles. That puts them out of order. Or they share the tile with the gas if you have just built them while the game is paused and did not let the gas escape.

1 minute ago, Coolthulhu said:

As for the solid-permeability: that isn't exactly correct either, as tiles also "contain their material"

Ah, you're right. It didn't occur to me that I should check it.

3 minutes ago, Coolthulhu said:

On a side note, cycling through large amounts of stuff gets slightly buggy - sort order differs from the "display order".

I find that most annoying with pipe bridges. They always pop up first, before the topmost building.