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Polluted Oxygen


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How did u get the hydrogen down to negative -120? I have three thermo regulators and it overheats way before the temperature gets to below -30 degrees C. Plus the temperature of the hydrogen in the pipe equalises to about 20 degrees C before the thermo regulators cool down and starts again.   Or is it because I made my pipes with granite and iron for the thermo cycles?

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5 hours ago, Jass steam2017 said:

How did u get the hydrogen down to negative -120? I have three thermo regulators and it overheats way before the temperature gets to below -30 degrees C. Plus the temperature of the hydrogen in the pipe equalises to about 20 degrees C before the thermo regulators cool down and starts again.   Or is it because I made my pipes with granite and iron for the thermo cycles?

You have to cool down your thermo regulators either using water or with weezewhorths.

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8 hours ago, Jass steam2017 said:

Plus the temperature of the hydrogen in the pipe equalises to about 20 degrees C before the thermo regulators cool down and starts again.   Or is it because I made my pipes with granite and iron for the thermo cycles?

Granite has high thermal conductivity. That means you should use it inside of the area that you want to cool, but outside of it you should use pipes made of abyssalite to prevent any heat exchange.

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10 hours ago, Whispershade said:

Converting polluted oxygen into liquid oxygen turns it into pure oxygen when reheated.  It is a way of purifying Polluted Oxygen without consuming non-renewable resources.

Thanks.

But doesn't it seem too much of a hassle?

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On AU, I used an oxygen purifier able to process 1kg/s of oxygen... It wasn't quite enough for a 48 dupes colony. But the problem wasn't the throughput but the input. I built it mainly to get rid of those pockets of 50kg polluted oxygen per tile. And those pockets vanished one after the other in the purifier. I caught a few morbs (arround 10) but it wasn't enough. In OU, the sand seems to be less of a problem. So I'm not sure it's still usefull to build this. But people will always build it for two reasons: because they can and because it's cool !

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3 hours ago, Cilya said:

So I'm not sure it's still usefull to build this. But people will always build it for two reasons: because they can and because it's cool !

Quite literally cool! :D

There are a few ways to get sustainable sources of polluted oxygen. If you fill an outhouse but don't clean it (set priority to 1), 3 morbs will spawn from it (eventually). While doing this the outhouse will gas off polluted oxygen as well. Deconstruct it after the morbs have all spawned and put the polluted dirt in a storage container and it'll continue to gas off until it's turned into dirt on it's own. Another source is slime, so if you're not using your puft farm to produce slime for mushrooms, you can also storage that slime in storage containers. It will also slowly gas off over time. Polluted water also gas off polluted oxygen but to get any appreciable output you need a very large surface area and you need to have constant slow circulation.

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7 hours ago, Prakhar said:

But doesn't it seem too much of a hassle?

As Cilya says, the OU changed the sand/deodorizer situation such that it's a lot easier to use deodorizers.  A lot, lot easier.  But it's still good to know how to build an oxygen liquifying setup, because I'd guess that the deodorizer/sand situation will be nerfed sooner or later.  Also if you want an 'infinitely sustainable base', then deodorizers aren't an option as there's no practical method of making sand yet (from what I understand).  But I would guess the amount of sand spawned in a given map is enough to purify all the PO in the asteroid a few times over as things stand right now.

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3 hours ago, Cilya said:

On AU, I used an oxygen purifier able to process 1kg/s of oxygen... It wasn't quite enough for a 48 dupes colony. But the problem wasn't the throughput but the input. I built it mainly to get rid of those pockets of 50kg polluted oxygen per tile. And those pockets vanished one after the other in the purifier. I caught a few morbs (arround 10) but it wasn't enough. In OU, the sand seems to be less of a problem. So I'm not sure it's still usefull to build this. But people will always build it for two reasons: because they can and because it's cool !

I have my oxygen liquefier hooked up to a PH2O to PO2 converter system that produces about 1kg/s PO2 at this time.  I can keep adding to it to increase the PO2 production, but I'm thinking about rebuilding it so the flow duct is 2 tiles wide instead of 1.

While they buffed deodorizer so the conversion rate is a lot better than before, the PH2O-PO2-O2 still has the best conversion rate of 1:1

 

 

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14 hours ago, Reaniel said:

I have my oxygen liquefier hooked up to a PH2O to PO2 converter system that produces about 1kg/s PO2 at this time.  I can keep adding to it to increase the PO2 production, but I'm thinking about rebuilding it so the flow duct is 2 tiles wide instead of 1.

While they buffed deodorizer so the conversion rate is a lot better than before, the PH2O-PO2-O2 still has the best conversion rate of 1:1

 

 

Ok how do you convert PH20 to PO2?

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Polluted Water continuously emits polluted oxygen. I believe the exact amount can be seen in the daily reports on the line "Sublimation". It's something people should care about in their colony as anywhere there is polluted water, polluted oxygen can be emitted and help to spread diseases.

However, I didn't know that, if handled correctly, this can lead to a steady production of polluted oxygen in enough quantities to feed an oxygen liquefier. I'll let @Reaniel answer, but I believe that greater quantities of polluted oxygen are emitted if the polluted water is spread on large shallow areas.

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Yes, basically, you can create an area dedicated to producing PO2, and I've created mine with mesh and airflow tiles to increase exposure surface.  I'm still testing how exactly PH2O exposure to air via airflow tile work as my current structure is producing a lot less than what I was expecting, but it's converting about 1kg/s for now (I'm refilling it at about 1kg/s of PH2O without it overflowing).

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55 minutes ago, brummbar7 said:

I would have imagined that the code only checks the tile above the water for offgassing, ignoring the sides and bottom since 'normally' those would not be air-accessible.  It's already kind of an OP strategy even if sides and bottom *don't* offgas...

Ok, here's what I found right now.  Apparently, there are two checks:

1. Whether a PH2O tile is under another PH2O/liquid tile or not:  Basically, it checks first if a tile of PH2O is "submerged" or not.  If it is, then it will not convert to PO2 (so having a thin layer of H2O on top will prevent it from converting).  If it doesn't have another liquid tile above it, it then goes to the 2nd check.

2. Whether the PH2O tile is exposed to air:  After the first check, it then check to see if it has any adjacent tile of air.  If it does have an adjacent air tile on any of its 4 sides, it will be able to convert.  Like other game mechanisms, diagonal tiles has zero effect to it.

Interestingly, when a cell satisfies check 1, the air tile (inside of airflow tiles) can be under it or on the sides but still satisfying check 2.  However, having a straight column of PH2O surrounded by airflow tiles will not increase emission because any thing below the top tile won't pass check #1.

As for Screenshot...  I actually just accidentally overridden my saves, and I don't have one that could show my very recent build (I was tearing it down after running the tests).  This screen shot is from about 300 cycles earlier, for my second build when I tried to build my various contraptions close together. This one produces only about 250g/s.

Oldsave.thumb.png.b8789fa96e22f5e0fbf1fc738fd68414.png

I had the PH2O rows at 2 tiles wide because I had some problem with the polluted water getting stuck or flowing really slow.  But now I know this only wastes space, and I would get much better conversion if I was to make the PH2O rows at 1 tiles.  You can pretty much just keep building this up.  There isn't much issue with heat loss when you tear open the top lid.  It's more of the super compressed cells of PO2 that's really annoying.  I had to do a semi-rebuild to add another vent inside the liquefier because the first vent will be mostly overpressured.

The Thermo switch is shared by both the Aquatuner (just 1) and Regulators (3), and set at -200C.  I didn't have the Aquatuner powerlines set up yet in here though.

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On 10/09/2017 at 1:25 AM, Reaniel said:

Ok, here's what I found right now.  Apparently, there are two checks:

1. Whether a PH2O tile is under another PH2O/liquid tile or not:  Basically, it checks first if a tile of PH2O is "submerged" or not.  If it is, then it will not convert to PO2 (so having a thin layer of H2O on top will prevent it from converting).  If it doesn't have another liquid tile above it, it then goes to the 2nd check.

2. Whether the PH2O tile is exposed to air:  After the first check, it then check to see if it has any adjacent tile of air.  If it does have an adjacent air tile on any of its 4 sides, it will be able to convert.  Like other game mechanisms, diagonal tiles has zero effect to it.

Interestingly, when a cell satisfies check 1, the air tile (inside of airflow tiles) can be under it or on the sides but still satisfying check 2.  However, having a straight column of PH2O surrounded by airflow tiles will not increase emission because any thing below the top tile won't pass check #1.

As for Screenshot...  I actually just accidentally overridden my saves, and I don't have one that could show my very recent build (I was tearing it down after running the tests).  This screen shot is from about 300 cycles earlier, for my second build when I tried to build my various contraptions close together. This one produces only about 250g/s.

Oldsave.thumb.png.b8789fa96e22f5e0fbf1fc738fd68414.png

I had the PH2O rows at 2 tiles wide because I had some problem with the polluted water getting stuck or flowing really slow.  But now I know this only wastes space, and I would get much better conversion if I was to make the PH2O rows at 1 tiles.  You can pretty much just keep building this up.  There isn't much issue with heat loss when you tear open the top lid.  It's more of the super compressed cells of PO2 that's really annoying.  I had to do a semi-rebuild to add another vent inside the liquefier because the first vent will be mostly overpressured.

The Thermo switch is shared by both the Aquatuner (just 1) and Regulators (3), and set at -200C.  I didn't have the Aquatuner powerlines set up yet in here though.

Doing some tinkering with this myself, and just found that as per your point 2), it won't emit anything if in a vacuum. If I introduce even a few grams of gas (any gas it seems) then it will start emitting like crazy ;) I'm curious as to whether flowing liquid emits at the same rate as still...

image.thumb.png.bafc6a10404b067a5cb315ba176ee15d.png

**Quick edit**

As per the above pic - from left to right, running on max speed for 15 minutes. After 15 mins I mopped all water, deconstructed everything and let the gasses average out for 5 mins. Not the most scientific, but should give an idea of what to avoid ;) 

Before I started the timer (whilst paused in debug) I introduced 50kg of polluted oxygen in each room, and primed all surfaces with 10kg of polluted surface water.

A-D from Left to right.

A)14*23 room * ~539g per tile= 173.6kg -50 = ~123.6kg gain

B)14x23 room * ~148g per tile =47.7kg -50 = ~2.3kg loss... (I'm putting this down to some dodgey water-destruction)

C)14x17 room * ~613g per tile = 145.9kg -50 = ~95.9kg gain

D)14x17 room * ~1527g per tile = 363.4kg -50 = ~313.4kg gain

In summary, the design @Reanielhas been working on is very efficient for the space used, and it's something i'd be tempted to tinker with further... However.....

As a little side test I also threw some morbs in a pool of polluted water to see what they'd create in the same time...

Test M) 5 morbs emitting PO2 constantly for 15 minutes filled 12 tiles with over 30kg per tile, for a whopping 360kg ;) 

Pic to explain :D They love it....

image.thumb.png.0bb8d40eca65f073de887cc1ab6a923d.png

Anyways, it's silly am and i'm too tired to do any exact measurements, but food for thought none the less ;) 

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1 hour ago, Lifegrow said:

After 15 mins I mopped all water, deconstructed everything and let the gasses average out for 5 mins.

 Very nice!

Test setup B wont work very well because most of the PH2O isnt contacting the air.

I will have to adjust my setup to one like test D.

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6 hours ago, Lifegrow said:

D)14x17 room * ~1527g per tile = 363.4kg -50 = ~313.4kg gain

In summary, the design @Reanielhas been working on is very efficient for the space used

Polluted water outgassing is proportional to amount of polluted water in the tile and to the number of exposed water tiles. Since in his design the water has large exposed area and the exposed tiles are under pressure with more than 800 kg of polluted water per tile in most tiles, it also turns to more polluted oxygen. I like the design a lot. I believe the mesh tiles aren't necessary though, the trick is in the gas permeable walls and their ability to withstand any pressure.

 

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9 hours ago, Lifegrow said:

Test M) 5 morbs emitting PO2 constantly for 15 minutes filled 12 tiles with over 30kg per tile, for a whopping 360kg ;) 

I ran a few tests. Morbs emit 11g/s when submerged in polluted water. Slightly less in clean water, 10.6g/s, the difference is probably the polluted water itself gassing off.

Note that morbs run to the bottom left corner and stay there when submerged. They will try to jump up and escape. Also note that you must use regular tiles, if you use air permeable tiles to make the tank out of as the morbs stop producing when overpressurized if there's air permeable tiles next to it.

Edit: It appears polluted water gas off 0.7g/s per optimally exposed tile.

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20 minutes ago, BlueLance said:

Wait so morbs dont die when submerged??? do they have to be fully submerged or could you in theory put them in shallow water that hatches can survive in and have hatches/morbs at the bottom feeding pufts at the top and satisfying your coal needs?

No they don't die when submerged anymore. They have to be fully submerged but hatches could walk on mesh tiles above. Not sure why you'd want to have hatches eat slime as that's far more useful either as fertilizer from mushrooms or as a source for water and oxygen via an algae distiller making polluted water and polluted oxygen directly, and algae that can be used for oxygen generation.

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Thats useful to know, and good point the hatches would eat the slime straight away so it's not like I need to worry about stopping them gassing out.

I usually have a secondary power supply in-case things go wrong, so storing the coal is nice for me. Although I usually never need to use it. I don't grow mushrooms I am a mealwood scrub, even in the old patches I use mealwood. and I don't really have any water woes, other than 4 electrolyzers I do not use water and their design is inefficient so they are only on for periods of times.

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