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Tech Study: Combustion ---> Industry


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Feature #1 - Advanced Storage: This storage is 3x2, storing 3 times more, but needing cold metals to do so. It will reduce temperature as well. In addition, it safely seals the hazards of resources.

Feature #2 - Basic Factory: A 3x4 structure. Belches CO2 and heat fiendishly, requires a worker plus coal, but generates a whopping 2400 electricity.

Feature #3 - Chemical Plant: A 3x4 structure. Requires chlorine, coal, oxygen, water and 200 electricity. Cleans the air and water, requiring a worker. But it's hazardous inside the plant. Unusually produces nitrogen as a byproduct.

Feature #4 - Heavy Conductance Wire: A massively better wire that can hold up to 3000 electricity, but very expensive at 100 resources each. Only Copper or Gold Amalgam can be used for this.

Feature #5 - Manufactory: Requires metals, copper, and coal, heavy electricity, produces massive co2, but allows you to upgrade your digging OR building tool to a more advanced version(100% gain). Intense heats as well.

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Feature #1 - Advanced Storage: This storage is 3x2, storing 3 times more, but needing cold metals to do so. It will reduce temperature as well.

Store what? Liquids? Gas? Solids?

Feature #2 - Basic Factory: A 3x4 structure. Belches CO2 and heat fiendishly, requires a worker plus coal, but generates a whopping 2400 electricity.

2400 will instantly overload any wires in the game

Feature #3 - Chemical Plant: A 3x4 structure. Requires chlorine, coal, oxygen, and 200 electricity. Generates bleach, sulfur, and nitrogen, and really increases heat as well. Requires a worker, but hazards in it make it normally unbreathable.

How does chlorine + hydrogen + carbon + oxygen = sodium + chlorine + oxygen + sulfur + nitrogen

Bleach = sodium + chlorine + oxygen

Where does the sodium, sulfur and nitrogen come from? Where does the carbon and hydrogen go?

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1: Solids. It's an upgrade to the old storage.
2: Look at the new wire, #4 for an upgrade.
3: First it processes the chlorine and coal to create a cleaning and filtration base which, not said, purifies water and co2 levels massively. However, the chlorine and coal combo is very dangerous, breaking half the coal and chlorine into nitrogen, and the other half creates the bleach and sulfur conjecture. But no carbon and hydrogen is produced - instead, the heat is rather massive when active. To make up, requires a high initial amount of algae.

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1 minute ago, Developous said:

1: Solids. It's an upgrade to the old storage.
2: Look at the new wire, #4 for an upgrade.
3: First it processes the chlorine and coal to create a cleaning and filtration base which, not said, purifies water and co2 levels massively. However, the chlorine and coal combo is very dangerous, breaking half the coal and chlorine into nitrogen, and the other half creates the bleach and sulfur conjecture. But no carbon and hydrogen is produced - instead, the heat is rather massive when active.

3. Nothing you describe is chemically correct.

chlorine + coal (hydrogen + carbon + oxygen) will never make nitrogen, bleach (sodium + chlorine + oxygen) or sulfur

nitrogen, sodium and sulfur needs to come from somewhere and they cannot be created from other things. And hydrogen + carbon needs to go somewhere.

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3>

A. There's small pockets of chlorine out there. While this limits options, the key is to just use that initial supply of gas. Hydrogen and carbon have nothing to do with ANY process with this device - just the use of the chlorine gas.

B. The carbon process is generally absorbed by the resources used to first make the plant. It takes the highest levels of algae to make this plant, and that absorbs the co2 in the plant. Further, Chlorine is the cleaning agent for water, purifying it on the highest level.

C. So, where does the sodium come from? Didn't think about that. The basis I placed on Chlorine and Coal was filtration elements. I knew that some side-effect would happen from that conjecture, so, I guess that means, based on bleach, that won't happen. But what would Chlorine and Coal result in? I'm thinking half the process goes to nitrogen, and the other half goes to 2 other aspects - a gas and resource. Based not on Realism, but on the cleaning factor of the factory, I decided on Bleach(a cleaning resource) and Sulfur (the hazard gas for this) via a very complicated chemical process - avoiding further costs with algae use.

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1 minute ago, Developous said:

3>

A. There's small pockets of chlorine out there. While this limits options, the key is to just use that initial supply of gas. Hydrogen and carbon have nothing to do with this process with this device.

B. The carbon process is generally absorbed by the resources used to first make the plant. It takes the highest levels of algae to make this plant, and that absorbs the co2 in the plant. Further, Chlorine is the cleaning agent for water, purifying it on the highest level.

C. So, where does the sodium come from? Didn't think about that. The basis I placed on Chlorine and Coal was filtration elements. I knew that some side-effect would happen from that conjecture, so, I guess that means, based on bleach, that won't happen. But what would Chlorine and Coal result in? I'm thinking half the process goes to nitrogen, and the other half goes to 2 other aspects - a gas and resource. Based not on Realism, but on the cleaning factor of the factory, I decided on Bleach(a cleaning element) and Sulfur (the hazard of the factory) via a very complicated chemical process.

There is no chemical process that would result in what you are wanting to be produced. It doesn't need to be 100% accurate as I didn't even mentioned about how to process it to create those items but it still has to make some sort of sense and that means everything you put in and everything that comes out has to make sense.

And nothing about coal + chlorine = nitrogen + bleach + sulfur makes sense. 

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I DIDN'T base it on realism - I based it on the cleaning factors. Based on that physics model, the key here is the chlorine is an acid, the coal is heavy, and the cost factor is more on the lines of the acidic factor between these 2 resources. This acid basis manifests based on the factor of the coal, decomposing that resource to a corrosion element, ignoring sodium(there's quite a few inputs already), translating into sulfur(the corrosion) and bleach(the cleaning) based on the acidic factors of chlorine - not proper physics, but looking at cleaning elements. This takes the heat element of coal, turns it acidic(sulfur), then strips the composition from the chlorine to gain the basis for nitrogen and bleach.

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4 minutes ago, Developous said:

I DIDN'T base it on realism - I based it on the cleaning factors. Based on that physics model, the key here is the chlorine is light, the coal is heavy, and the cost factor is more on the lines of the acidic factor between these 2 resources. This acid basis manifests based on the factor of the coal, decomposing that resource to a corrosion element, ignoring sodium(there's quite a few inputs already), translating into sulfur(the corrosion) and bleach(the cleaning) based on the acidic factors of chlorine - not proper physics, but looking at cleaning elements.

But the whole game is based on realism and physics and chemistry. This will only confuse people.

You know what, let's stop this. If you want to continue ignoring the fact that it doesn't make sense and that what you based it on doesn't mean anything if people are going to think it doesn't make sense then go ahead. 

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2 minutes ago, AlexRou said:

But the whole game is based on realism and physics and chemistry. This will only confuse people 

1. Sodium (purposefully ignored to keep outputs low). Normally, devices only have 2 modules, and this would make it 3. Sodium instead of coal WOULDN'T achieve the cleaning factor of the factory, which is the main purpose of the chemical process. So I dropped this resource.

> {compromise} - No bleach, no nitrogen.

Deal? This just confuses the sulfur basis, which diverges to the cleaning factors involved.

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k. Sorry. But thanks for the fundamentals.

Now, how to validate this tech further......

Physics can advance based on the relations of the aspects, taking their compositions in alternate ways.

The key here... breaking down the composition, not looking at normal but relational physics, to define it. However, the catch being that you can only use each factor once, and all the factors must be used..... Further, the more it's reversed/exclusive the more complex it is. In addition, on the physics principle, divergence can only be in relation to the basis, which anything other than normal physics increased complexity.

Chorine Basis: Water, Cleaning, Acid.
Coal Basis: Oxygen, Heat, Heavy

Based on this formula... and considering the single resource divergence = 30% complexity estimated. But it's otherwise linear.

Input: Coal(resource), Chlorine(gas), Electricity(wires).
Structural Basis: {chemical} - So the chlorine is the bigger factor. 2 parts chlorine + 1 part coal per conversion point, thus. This is also the better cleaning factor as well, not diverging from physics there.
Internal Factors:
1. 30% divergence factor can result in a single new gas/resource - So, the cleaning element will also help plants, based on the oxygen factor. This means nitrogen is produced. But... 30% divergence, that means you must not have 'mouth breather' due to the chemical composition.
2. Oxygen + Water + Cleaning. This means the factory can clean the co2 in the air(gasmask filter basis - uses the o2 factor), and the hazards in the water(chlorine water and cleaning basis).
3. This leaves the Acid, Heat, and Heavy compositions to be used. So... {good variant} Bleach {bad variant} Sulfur.
Output Factors:
{Intentional} Co2 and contaminated water cleaning + Expels Nitrogen where present + Makes Bleach at place.
{Side Effects} Heavy Sulfur Byproduct - a heavy corrosion element.
Construction Factors:
Due to acid, chemicals, and cleaning, you need extremely high supplies of integrity, conductance, and insulation. Due to this, only Algae(ultimate high), Metals, and Gold Amalgam can be used to build it.

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This is a suggestions and feedback forums.  The whole structure of this thread feels rather heavy handed in its approach especially with a poll of "YES I WANT MORE STUFF", "NO I'M GRUMPY" and "Huh?  Game?  What game?" options being presented to the voter...  It just feels as if it's attempting to bias users into voting one or the other, and you keep shooting specific answers for any questions asked.

If you want your ideas to actually contribute, you should open them to a discussion, and not a "YEAH", "NOE" or "MEH" decision as you did with the poll.

Given a broader assessment of your original post, I agree with the following, in a more generalized way as being described:

  • Bigger storage (assuming an advancement over storage compactor) which takes more space, requires more materials (and probably additional research to unlock the blueprints) which allows more items stored and also regulates temperature.
  • A higher tier energy generator.  Requires a dedicated duplicant operating it, takes a lot of space and presents the user with challenges of design to handle heat and whatever resource might be required (I'm not necessarily sold on coal, considering a coal generator already exists).
  • Manufactory - providing an upgrade to equipment and the like, once again not sold on this obsession you have with everything needing to give off heat.

Dislike:

  • Chemical plant - seems kinda random to me.
  • Heavy Wire - In general I disagree with the way the power system in ONI currently works.  I think a bit of a rework in general is due rather than keep piling on higher load wires on a circuit which will eventually need to be completely rewired with it.
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Chemical plant - I placed it on basis of some divergence from physics. If you look at the recent post, it breaks down the compositional fundamentals of each resource. You see, each gas and resource can be analyzed symbolically for it's composition. But the greater the altercations, the more complicated it becomes - ultimate being a complete reverse which is ultimate complexity.

Heavy Wire + Factory - I would agree, but it not only adds more diversity, but that frustrating element of advancing the values. However, I'm all for upgraded variants of things, and that for the factory as well. It's basically an upgraded coal producer. Just like the coal plant, but on a higher level than usual.

Part of the coal basis = heat.

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One you need to simplify what you're saying most of it is just jargon and the wall of text is off putting to most people I would presume. I know you're keen and eager to put your idea out there but approach it more subtle and be open to criticism. And it has to make sense chemically and reactions wise. Thanks 

The only thing I agree with is the extra storage (as the other stuff doesn't make sense to me and power needs a revision anyway). 

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